Original sin or original forgiveness ? (Creator, Earth, Torah, paradise)

[maro]

Original Sin or original forgiveness .... what's the lesson

The story of Adam and Eve are quite similar in the Bible and the Quran with minor differences yet the lessons derived from these stories differ greatly. Sometimes minor changes to any document can completely alter the actual meaning of the story. Both the scriptures talk about the creation of Adam and then Eve which are somewhat similar. However the events after their creation are of significance.

Soon after God commands them not to eat of this particular tree as eating of it would cause harm to them and the act would be transgression.

We said: "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression." – [Quran 2:35]


According to the Bible, God said that if they would eat from this tree, they would die. But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. – [Genesis 2:17]

According to the Bible, this warning was given to Adam before the creation of his wife, Eve. However the Quran corrects this bit and mentions that at the time of the warning, Eve already existed as the verse refers to both.


Woman misled Man or Satan misled Man?

Soon after enters the role of Satan who according to the Bible whispered to Eve saying that if they would eat of this tree then they would never die, contrary to what God warned Adam earlier. This is an important stage in the stories of the two scriptures. According to the Bible, it was the woman who was led astray and she ate the fruit and also gave it to Adam.

And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. – [Genesis 3:6]

The Quran does not put the burden of the sin on the woman but makes it clear that both were led astray by Satan and hence both are equally responsible for it.

Then did Satan make them slip from the (garden), and get them out of the state (of felicity) in which they had been. We said: "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood - for a time. – [Quran 2:36]

From these verses it is clear that both Adam and Eve were misled by Satan and it was not the woman who made the man do wrong. When religious doctrines like the Bible states that it was Eve who came under the influence of the whispers of Satan and thus ate the forbidden fruit and gave it to Adam to eat, it subliminally programs men to believe that woman is evil by nature. When God asks Adam from where he got the sense that he was naked, meaning the sense of shame, Adam replied:

And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. – [Genesis 3:11]

Clearly Adam is accusing the woman as being the culprit and later on when we keep on reading this chapter, we see that it is further clarified that Adam listened to his wife an under her influence ate the fruit (Genesis 3:16) rather than under the influence of Satan. The Quran corrects this and makes it clear that while Satan did mislead the woman, Satan also misled the man.


Original Sin or Original Forgiveness?

This act of Adam and Eve eating the forbidden fruit is labeled by Christianity as the Original Sin. They say that because of this Original Sin, all people born afterwards were born in sin. The newborn baby according to Christianity is a sinner. Islam however goes on to give us a deeper lesson from the story.

It is learnt that after eating from the forbidden tree, Adam repented and God forgave him for God is Most Merciful. This is the lesson given to all Mankind by Quran. It is not of the Original Sin but of Original Forgiveness which shows the Merciful nature of God.

Man is by nature bound to commit sins either of small or major magnitude. God knows this nature of man because He is the Creator. God on the other hand is Most Merciful and is there to forgive man when he sincerely repents. The lesson derived from the Quran gives us a better picture of the nature of God. For forgiveness, all man needs to do is to turn towards God, repent for the wrong he did and promise not to repeat it. God who is Most Merciful then forgives the creation and on the Day of Judgment, this act will not be held up against him.

Thus the lesson which God wanted to give for all of humanity was that of Original Forgiveness rather than Original Sin. Islam teaches us this lesson and informs us that all newborns are without the burden of any sin on their shoulders. They are innocent. From the story the theme is easy to understand. God created man – Man committed sin – Man turned towards God for forgiveness – God forgave man for indeed God is Most Merciful

[Booko]

Maro:

If you're going to put up articles from other sources, you need to include the link:

http://www.thetruecall.com/home/modu...rticle&sid=300


From the rules:

20. )We will enforce our understanding of intellectual property rights. Plagarism is not allowed and material originating with another author must be identified by Title (if available), author and publisher (or web site). Keep it to a few sentences or a short paragraph or two with a cite and link to the source. It must be within the standards of Fair Use.

[maro]

Originally Posted by Booko

Maro:

If you're going to put up articles from other sources, you need to include the link:

http://www.thetruecall.com/home/modu...rticle&sid=300


From the rules:

20. )We will enforce our understanding of intellectual property rights. Plagarism is not allowed and material originating with another author must be identified by Title (if available), author and publisher (or web site). Keep it to a few sentences or a short paragraph or two with a cite and link to the source. It must be within the standards of Fair Use.

it's ok Booko .... i understand

[fullyveiled muslimah]

There are many many important issues that are to be gleaned from this story. This is why Allah reveals it in such detail both in the Torah and the Quran. Allah in Quran even describes the action of Adam and Hawwa as a slip. A slip is hardly something to go on and on about. Definitely not something to further punish the rest of mankind with.

There are many points to consider in this story. One point is about mans decision making in the face of not knowing all the information. Allah clearly told Adam and Hawa not to eat of the tree. Previously Adam had witnessed what happened to shaitan as a result of his disobediance to a direct command. Adam saw that shaitan was stripped of his honor, dignity, and physical beauty. The penalty was severe for shaitan because he did not have the benefit of doubt. He (shaitan) had been in communion with and visual contact with Allah for some time. SHaitan had full knowledge of what the penalties would entail should he disobey direct orders. Adam meanwhile has watched it all go down between Allah and shaitan. Despite this, Adam and hawa fall prey to the same line of thought. Shaitan figured since he was better than Adam on the basis that Adam was inferior to shaitan because of Adams origins versus shaitan's origin, that he would not show Adam the respect that Allah had prescribed. Pretty much the first racism. Adam simlarly felt that since the tree did not seem harmful that no harm could come to him or his wife, despite the direct order from Allah not only to not eat but that it would be a harm if they ate it. Adam saw shaitan be expelled from paradise due to his little mishap, but Adam suffered from the same thing we suffer from today. That is the 'its not gonna happen to me' syndrome.


Then Allah after all was said and done sounds the warning to all subsequent generations of man:


27. O Children of Adam! Let not Shaitân (Satan) deceive you, as he got your parents [Adam and Hawwa (Eve)] out of Paradise, stripping them of their raiments, to show them their private parts. Verily, he and Qabîluhu (his soldiers from the jinns or his tribe) see you from where you cannot see them. Verily, We made the Shayâtin (devils) Auliyâ' (protectors and helpers) for those who believe not.

This is ultimately the lesson to be learned. Not to fall prey to the same trick. Surely shaitan uses the same tricks over again, but we don't learn from the past mistakes because we don't see them as mistakes. The trick is for shaitan to use simple suggestions to make us justify why we do not have to obey Allah's laws. To justify to ourselves how we may achieve the same goals or better, by coming up with our own ways to the contrary of what Allah says.

[yuvgotmel]

Musings on the term “Original Sin”

“Original Sin” implies that there is something that comes after it, such as “Duplicate Sin,” “Sins of Tradition,” “Normal Sin,” “the Usual Sin,” or the “UNoriginal Sin.” It also can be interpreted to mean that there was “sin” before the “Original Sin,” but the “Original Sin” was something that had never been done before.


Some of the definitions for “original” include, but are not limited to: new, fresh, never-before-seen, authentic, avant-garde, beginning, commencing, primary, underived, conceiving, creative, seminal, innovative, unprecedented, untried, unusual, first, anomaly, exemplar, bona fide, etc.


….Now, I’m reminded of karma: “What goes around comes around.” Karma suggests that there is nothing really “new” per se, but rather a cyclical event to all things. The life of an individual is said to heavily depend on what he/she did or did not do previously. This concept seems to allude to a linear “time” even as it displays how patterns overlap and parallels are made to merge “time.” Either way, the word “original” means NEW. If something is NEW, then apparently there was a “time” before that thing existed.


It appears that “sin” was already in existence. In fact, God was trying to mate Adam with animals, but Adam refused. And then Adam and Eve were running around naked. Those verses suggest—at least to me—that sin was already known and present. But what Adam and Eve did was totally avant-garde. Master Adam did something unconventional, untraditional and cutting edge in concept and design.


The seminal notion of Inventor Adam is unknown and we may never know, but it got him kicked out of the Garden of Eden (whatever it was). ….Which was NOT a bad thing, since he was formally made of dust….And once he was kicked out, he was clothed in leather. So….my theory, which is based upon Biblical research, is that if someone can be creative enough to come up with a sin that has never-before-been-seen, they can possibly get some new clothes.Right now, everyone is just in copycat syndrome, which is not that enticing or interesting. But if someone can make an unprecedented move into an authentic sin, they might get the attention of the gods. And they will gather and say, “Now, this man has become like one of us.” And they will kick man off Planet Earthsville forever.


Now... I’m NOT suggesting that sin should be compared to pioneering, but what I am saying directly is that an “Original Sin” can be seen as an enterprising venture. I liken it to the Science Fair competition in schools. The judges (gods) are looking for something inspiring, exotic, visionary, and ground breaking. This is the kind of stuff that wins awards.


This is what the judges do not want to see: sex with animals—that’s already been done; adultery—that’s old school; drugs—that’s just too common; greed—yeah, yeah everyone’s got that…. The judges are looking for something revolutionary and none of the UNoriginal sin stuff. Those are taboo. Top 10 no-nos for your creation projects are: “adultery, murder, stealing, cursing, yadda, yadda.”


So, to get back to Karma, which is a cycle of hell, I believe that my interpretation of “Original Sin” can END all that. It’s like a promotion. It works in business all the time. People want the latest thing on the market!


…Anyway, you can disagree, but I have only one thing to say: The Artists are always the first to take a beating when it comes to creativity.

[James the Persian]

Could I just please point out that when you speak of Original Sin you are speaking not of a universal Christian belief but rather one that is specifically western? We eastern Christians do sometimes use the term but when we do we mean a very different concept from that that an RC or Protestant might mean (though some more modern RC sources suggest an understanding that is coming rather close to our own).

James

[maro]

Originally Posted by JamesThePersian

Could I just please point out that when you speak of Original Sin you are speaking not of a universal Christian belief but rather one that is specifically western? We eastern Christians do sometimes use the term but when we do we mean a very different concept from that that an RC or Protestant might mean (though some more modern RC sources suggest an understanding that is coming rather close to our own).

James

james,can you please explain the concept of original sin ,in eastern christianity , and how it differs from that of the RC or protestant