Humility (Jesus, ritual, Buddhism, soul, grace)

[Bishka]

What's you take on humility?

For Christians, do you believe: "Those who are humble recognize their dependence on the Lord"(Teachings of the Presidents of the Church, Brigham Young. 179)

[Bishka]

"We are nothing only what the Lord makes us." (Deseret News Weekly. Brigham Young. 28 Oct 1857, 5)

[Master Vigil]

As a Taoist and a Vigil. I recognize humility to be the key to enlightenment, simplicity, and oneness with Tao. Sadly, I see the message of humility fluent within christian teachings. However, I see less christians "walking the walk" than I do of people of other faiths. Namely Buddhism. But I see this not as a religious problem per se, but a cultural problem.

[jeffrey]

Master Vigil, I agree with you. So be humble in all aspects. To not put yourself above anyone or anything. John the Baptist humbled himself to Jesus. Do not brag or boast about how you or your religion is better then someone else's. in this life or the next.

[Fluffy]

Humility is one of those few things that I believe should be balanced ever so carefully. It is easy to humble yourself so much so as to devalue your own worth and the danger of going in the opposite direction is, through arrogance, devaluing the worth of others.

However, I dislike the idea of balance in all things as a philosophy and so this is one of the few things that I have trouble with. I am much more inclined to say that it is better to devalue yourself utterly, through humility, than to become arrogant. But I find myself unable to agree with either of the quotations from 'Teachings of the Presidents of the Church'. I feel that I am currently lacking the mindset or vital fact needed to approach this problem in the best manner.

[Shadow Wolf]

Humility is one of the first steps to spiritual enlightenment.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Fluffy

Humility is one of those few things that I believe should be balanced ever so carefully. It is easy to humble yourself so much so as to devalue your own worth and the danger of going in the opposite direction is, through arrogance, devaluing the worth of others.

However, I dislike the idea of balance in all things as a philosophy and so this is one of the few things that I have trouble with. I am much more inclined to say that it is better to devalue yourself utterly, through humility, than to become arrogant. But I find myself unable to agree with either of the quotations from 'Teachings of the Presidents of the Church'. I feel that I am currently lacking the mindset or vital fact needed to approach this problem in the best manner.

I agree; humility is something difficult to 'get right'; apart from the reason you gave above, I find too much humility is in fact vanity.

I hope you will forgive me for sharing a poem I wrote on this some time back, but I think it demonstrates what I mean................

Oh not so subtle Man....


In all humility lies the greatest vanity
For as the preacher said "Vanity of vanities … all is vanity,”
he knew of what he spoke,
and in that vein drew blood from introvert humility,
and unmasked it for the vanity which it contained.

Nature's sweet revenge on our facaded ways is cunning hid,
and yet the answer's clear to see:
The tree that bears his fruit in leafy solitude,
that tree that laps the sun, and drains the rain;
His bark is there to see, but not to hear....
The silent, humble tree, so full of vanity.

And in the winters of his life,
He stands a naked crippled being,
and yet so stout and firm,
but swaying sometime to the winter wind.
Bleak in his nudity, oustripped of all that leaves
his branches bare, for there the frost to gnaw,
and sometime kill a part of him.....
The silent, humble tree, so full of vanity.

The rains of spring will fall and make him green again;
he'll try once more to do his best to turn another leaf,
to do the best he can, for which he was designed,
before cruel frost and dark beset his soul once more,
and turn his humble nakedness into brash vainglorious vanity,
The silent, humble tree, so full of vanity

[Scarlett Wampus]

Humility can mean something different to considering yourself lower than others. It can mean losing yourself! When that happens things are a lot more straightforward.

The opposite of pride is not self-loathing or socially-approved-of-servility but a vital kind of openness to things that can enliven our spirit. I think people lose themselves in God, in emptiness, in natural beauty, in all sorts of things really. Unfortunately because its something that cannot be contained or forced yet is deemed very important to spiritual life the version of humility we often get taught is an inauthentic imitation. Seeing this we learn to fake it too or risk disgrace. Its tragic because real humility is beautiful.

[kreeden]

IMHO it depends upon how one defines humility . Lack of false pride is cool . Lies get you nowhere , even if you are lying to yourself . However , humility can be other things also . Humility can even become pride . So what is humility really ? It is a quasi-emotion . Nothing more . You are what you are . No more , no less . And that is just what you should be .

[michel]

Originally Posted by Scarlett Wampus

Humility can mean something different to considering yourself lower than others. It can mean losing yourself! When that happens things are a lot more straightforward.

The opposite of pride is not self-loathing or socially-approved-of-servility but a vital kind of openness to things that can enliven our spirit. I think people lose themselves in God, in emptiness, in natural beauty, in all sorts of things really. Unfortunately because its something that cannot be contained or forced yet is deemed very important to spiritual life the version of humility we often get taught is an inauthentic imitation. Seeing this we learn to fake it too or risk disgrace. Its tragic because real humility is beautiful.

Wow, I never saw it that way; thanks for the insight.