For Christians: Where Do the Dinosaurs Fit In? (Earth, evolution)

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Starfish

Kind of a big wrench. Thanks for sharing!

See, I don't see this as a wrench at all. The reason I don't is that I do believe there was death before Adam and Eve -- just not spiritual death. I believe the earth is several billion years old and I believe dinosaurs walked the earth millions and millions of years before the first "human-like" creatures ever lived. I also believe there were creatures that scientists today refer to as Cro-Magnon man and Neadrathal Man, and I believe they lived before Adam and Eve. It is impossible for me to dispense with common sense or to simply dismiss the scientific evidence that is available today. I don't believe that Noah herded any dinosaurs onto the ark either.

What I believe is that at some point in time, God did create a man in His own image and called him Adam. He created a woman to be Adam's wife. He placed in them their spirits. They were the first of all God's literal spirit sons and daughters. None of the "human-like" creatures that had previously existed were part of the species we consider to be part of the human family today.

Eden was a place here on Earth that existed apart from what we LDS refer to as "the lone and dreary world." There would be no death in Eden -- either physical or spiritual, but there was death on the outside and there had been death on the outside for millions of years. Eden was a new beginning, the beginning of the family of God that would be redeemed by His Son, Jesus Christ.

I believe that all life was created by God, but that Adam and Eve (as opposed to some other "human-like" species) were our true first parents.

[Starfish]

Thanks for your replies.

I'd like to add to my theory.
Science says the earth is millions of years old. This is using a dating system that is based on assumptions. The assumption is that everything has always aged at the rate that it ages now. Or that those factors that the rate of aging is based on, are not always consistent.

Continents are moving now, but ever so slowly, I don't know the rate, inches, or less, per year? But we do know in the Bible that the continents once moved a great distance in one lifetime.
"And unto Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg; for in his days was the earth divided" (Gen 10:25)
Also in the Doctrine and Covenants 133:24 (non-LDS, please bear with me) "And the land of Jerusalem and the land of Zion shall be turned back into their own place, and the earth shall be like as it was in the days before it was divided."

So is it possible that at different times in the history of this earth, things happened at different rates and sometimes much more rapidly than today? If so, this would really throw the rate of aging totally out of whack. If continents can move and oceans formed in one lifetime, the measurements taken many centuries later might appear that it took millions of years.

More to think about.

[Katzpur]

So I'm just curious, Starfish... How old do you believe the earth is?

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Starfish

Ok. (I actually got this from a friend and it made a lot of sense.)
So did Noah then have the dinosaurs on his arc? Yes, but they were obviously not the size as we think of them. (I do have to sneak evolution in here a bit.)

Well, I kind of expected that we'd disagree on this, but I suppose that's okay, since we're both just theorizing anyway. But somehow, the idea that Noah had dinosaurs on the ark really doesn't make a lot of sense to me. It makes no sense to me at all! Are you saying you don't believe that the truly large dinosaurs ever existed or that Noah really just picked up a couple of small lizards and that they counted as dinosaurs?

[Starfish]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

So I'm just curious, Starfish... How old do you believe the earth is?

Since the fall, roughly 6000 years. Just as the Bible says. Before the fall--who knows?

[Starfish]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Well, I kind of expected that we'd disagree on this, but I suppose that's okay, since we're both just theorizing anyway. But somehow, the idea that Noah had dinosaurs on the ark really doesn't make a lot of sense to me. It makes no sense to me at all! Are you saying you don't believe that the truly large dinosaurs ever existed or that Noah really just picked up a couple of small lizards and that they counted as dinosaurs?

As I said when I first explained my theory, the ancestors of the dinosaurs possibly were much smaller. After leaving the arc, immediately after the flood, the conditions of the earth could have been extremely favorable for them to thrive, and to relatively quickly evolve to become very large (hence the dinosaurs we know about). But as the earth was going through a rapidly changing geologic turmoil, it continued to change, the dinosaur-favoring conditions ended, and they died out.

And you're right--just theories. It's fun, isn't it?

[fire]

[quote=Starfish;1071047]As Christians, I assume we all believe the Bible is real. But how do you figure in the dinosaurs? This could easily slip into an debate about evolution, but I 'd like to keep it specific to dinosaurs.
I have my theories that work quite nicely with the Bible. What do YOU think?


I have my own idea on dinosaurs which is: According to the bible, animals were created before Adam and Eve were placed in the Garden of Eden.
Next concept: The bible says God took 6 days, or creative periods to build the whole earth and on the 7th day he rested. The way I read the bible, there is no indication that the creative days or periods were continuous with out gaps. It is assumed that these creative episodes were successive without any gaps. With that assumption, there really isn't any good way to allow both realities to coexist.

(My little story. Lets say for example, I am a builder, and I say that I built my house in 90 days. The problem is, a lot of people casually observed my building project. And they know that it took me 3 years to build it. I am not lying, but they are right also! I spent a few days building the foundation and let it sit for a while to harden, and then I framed it and waited for the lumber to dry before starting the plumbing, etc etc etc. After 3 years the house was done and I rested, but I only spent 90 days on the job in that 3 years.)

So with that concept, there could have been billions of years between the advent of animals/dinosaurs and Adam and Eve. Also, there could have been dinosaurs roaming around while Adam was in the Garden of Eden. Why would the bible make a point of saying Adam and Eve were placed in the Garden of Eden. I am guessing the garden was free of dinosaurs and all other possible hazards, but the rest of the Earth was filled with all manor of animals and hazards. Hence the need for a safe haven, i.e., Garden of Eden.
Also, Adam and Eve could have been living for billions of years before partaking of the forbidden fruit in The Garden of Eden. God told them they would be kicked out of the Garden of Eden once they partook of the fruit. The bible only says Adam lived so many years after he was kicked out of the garden and doesn't indicate how long he was in the garden.
Anyhow, that’s my story.

[Sola'lor]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

See, I don't see this as a wrench at all. The reason I don't is that I do believe there was death before Adam and Eve -- just not spiritual death. I believe the earth is several billion years old and I believe dinosaurs walked the earth millions and millions of years before the first "human-like" creatures ever lived. I also believe there were creatures that scientists today refer to as Cro-Magnon man and Neadrathal Man, and I believe they lived before Adam and Eve. It is impossible for me to dispense with common sense or to simply dismiss the scientific evidence that is available today. I don't believe that Noah herded any dinosaurs onto the ark either.

What I believe is that at some point in time, God did create a man in His own image and called him Adam. He created a woman to be Adam's wife. He placed in them their spirits. They were the first of all God's literal spirit sons and daughters. None of the "human-like" creatures that had previously existed were part of the species we consider to be part of the human family today.

Eden was a place here on Earth that existed apart from what we LDS refer to as "the lone and dreary world." There would be no death in Eden -- either physical or spiritual, but there was death on the outside and there had been death on the outside for millions of years. Eden was a new beginning, the beginning of the family of God that would be redeemed by His Son, Jesus Christ.

I believe that all life was created by God, but that Adam and Eve (as opposed to some other "human-like" species) were our true first parents.

Hmm. You've got some good ideas here.

[Red Pill]

[quote=Katzpur;1072187]See, What I believe is that at some point in time, God did create a man in His own image and called him Adam. He created a woman to be Adam's wife. He placed in them their spirits. They were the first of all God's literal spirit sons and daughters. /quote]

How handy for Adam. I wonder what the story would be if a woman had recorded the story. First the animals- for human use, then man to labor, then the crowning achievement- woman. That is demeaning to men, I am sure.

How are women to feel about being created to be the wife? If that is so, why are they even self aware? Would God be kinder to have them be as beasts, and not be aware of their inequality?

God created women as his daughters. He gave them a great gift in being able to co- create life, along with all the other gifts humans in general received. Men have exercised unrighteous dominion through out history- claiming God commanded it. Funny, Christ didn't act that way...