Hi Christians, I got a question for you. (Jesus Christ, reject)

[Dentonz]

Originally Posted by sushannah

I believe there are alot of misconceptions about what happened in Israel during the time of the death of Jesus. One of those misconceptions is that the Jewish people are responsible for it. Sure the High Priest and and the temple functionaries were corrupt, these were the Sadducees. They had alot to lose so they did what they did and they alone are responsible for it. The penalty for breaking Jewish religious law was stoning, crucifiction was done by the Roman authorities and it was not done to people breaking religious law. It was done to individuals views as a threat to the Roman government. A Messiah who rules in Israel would have been viewed as a challenge to the Roman rulers and this was why Jesus was killed - his entry into the city earlier was viewed as him claiming Messiahship. Putting all this aside, what I really wanted to know was your own beliefs that are important to you. How you came by those beliefs, and if there is a scriptural background for those beliefs. I am interested in knowing if you as a Christian believe in replacement theology, or if maybe your particular denomination believes in it. I already know that this type of theology is rooted in anti-semitism no matter how it is explained. I only want to know if most Christians believe in it.

Honestly Sushannah I come from one of the most hard-nosed denominations there are and I have never met any Christian that believes in 'replacement theology'. I believe that Jesus is the Christ, the son of the living God, the messiah of the Old testament, and final King of Israel. My God is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and I absolutely love Jewish people. Jesus was a Jew, and he is my Lord and I owe my life to him because he gave his life for me.

Denton

[Terrywoodenpic]

Jesus was a jew, he never rejected his fellow Jews.
many of the early christians were Jews Paul had the task of converting many non Jews.

The jews had long expected a messiah. Jesus did not come up to many of their expectations.
He did not act like a King but as a servant,
He did not want to lead them against their enemies, he taught peace.
He did not believe in retribution, he taught forgiveness.

His whole life and message was something new.
He understood the Jews love of their law, but did not extend it to include his new teachings.

It is not surprising therefor that few jews, notwithstanding the prophecies, understood him to be the expected messiah,

Christians do not reject Jews any more than Christ did.
I suppose we are disappointed that they do not see the value of the way Jesus teachings changed the world,
or believe that what he taught was the word of God.

You can be a Christian with out knowing a single word of the old testament.
so do not see it as a battle between the two. One leads to the other but they do not depend on each other.

Terry_______________________
Blessed are the gentle, they shall inherit the land

[dawny0826]

Originally Posted by Dentonz

Honestly Sushannah I come from one of the most hard-nosed denominations there are and I have never met any Christian that believes in 'replacement theology'. I believe that Jesus is the Christ, the son of the living God, the messiah of the Old testament, and final King of Israel. My God is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and I absolutely love Jewish people. Jesus was a Jew, and he is my Lord and I owe my life to him because he gave his life for me.

Denton

Amen to that too, brother!

[sushannah]

This is in response to Terrywoodenpic

You are right about the Jews expecting a Messiah for a long time. Jesus and others came with claims of Messiahship. As of this moment, no single individual has totally fulfilled the scriptures that fortold the coming of the Messiah. Jesus did not reign as King of Israel in peace as the scriptures say the Messiah would. I understand that Christians believe these things will be fulfilled in a second coming; I am sorry to tell you that as far as I know, in Judaism, there is no such thing as a second coming of the Messiah. Maybe I am wrong, I don't know everything there is to know on the subject. This is why I am interested in what Christians believe, if there is a scriptural background for thier beliefs, and if they could possibly explain some of them to me.

You say the Tanakh (OT) and the NT do not depend on each other. I can understand how this is true for the tanakh, but the NT must depend on the tanakh, as this is the Jewish Messiah we are talking about. Without the tanakh, you would not have the law (which would leave nothing for Jesus to fulfill, according to Christians), you would not have the prophets (those in the Tanakh who fortold the coming of a Messiah). No reason to believe a Messiah was ever coming!

One thing I will tell you is this, if you know anything about Judaism, you would know that Jesus really taught nothing new. Love G-d and your neighbor were sayings also attributed to Hillel and are common beliefs in Judaism. I do not believe Jesus started a new religion, or ever intended to.
Jesus, the historical figure, seems to have little in common with the Jesus of Christian theology, in my mind.

I do not believe Jesus rejects the Jewish people, because Jesus was a Jewish Man. I know some Christians probably do not reject the Jews now, and there have always been those who have helped Jews in times of trouble, but you can't deny history my friend. Rejection and hatred of the Jewish people has been well documented and is a well known fact.

As far as I can gather, Jesus was a Jewish man who opposed the Roman occupation of Israel. Jesus also opposed corruption in the Temple and the office of the High Priest. These were not unusual sentiments of the Jewish people at that time. Jesus made a claim for Messiahship that was ended by his death at the hands of the Romans. I do not know of any scriptures that tell me clearly there is a second coming of the Messiah. When I speak of scriptures, I mean the Tanakh (OT), I hope you understand. I do not say any of this with ill feelings toward anyone, I am only looking for the truth. Maybe someone can help me find clear answers, if they are there to be found.

[sushannah]

Originally Posted by Dentonz

Honestly Sushannah I come from one of the most hard-nosed denominations there are and I have never met any Christian that believes in 'replacement theology'. I believe that Jesus is the Christ, the son of the living God, the messiah of the Old testament, and final King of Israel. My God is the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob and I absolutely love Jewish people. Jesus was a Jew, and he is my Lord and I owe my life to him because he gave his life for me.

Denton

What would you say to a observant Jewish person who doesn't believe that Jesus was the Messiah? Would you tell them that they are still G-d's chosen, that G-d loves the Jewish people and could never reject them, even if they live their entire life as a Jew; or would you tell them that they must be saved?