Is Buddhism a religion? (Jesus, salvation, reincarnation, Christianity, God)

[Rolling_Stone]

Originally Posted by PureX

Isn't that what 'enlightenment' is?

I should have been more concise. "Ultimate Ground" in this case means something with which the person have a personal relationship. Granted, some forms of Buddhism are religions, but as a non-theistic approach to 'enlightenment,' it doesn't qualify as a religion as I understand it.

[PureX]

What is a non-theistic approach to enlightenment? Does it involve an 'afterlife'? Or some altered ideal state as it's end goal?

For me, these kind of things would define it as religious, even if no specific deity were involved. I tend to consider any such 'supernatural' goals or states to be religious motivations. But what you're referring to may not be 'supernatural', in which case I would agree that what you're talking about is probably not what I'd consider a religious motivation.

In any case, though, I don't think there's anything wrong with religious motivations. If Buddhism is a religion for whatever percentage of people who participate in it, I say all the more to the good.

[Rolling_Stone]

Originally Posted by PureX

What is a non-theistic approach to enlightenment? Does it involve an 'afterlife'? Or some altered ideal state as it's end goal?

For me, these kind of things would define it as religious, even if no specific deity were involved. I tend to consider any such 'supernatural' goals or states to be religious motivations. But what you're referring to may not be 'supernatural', in which case I would agree that what you're talking about is probably not what I'd consider a religious motivation.

In any case, though, I don't think there's anything wrong with religious motivations. If Buddhism is a religion for whatever percentage of people who participate in it, I say all the more to the good.

We don't entirely disagree. I just regard "Godless religion," however "God" is conceived, to be an oxymoron--a denial of or ignoring of the Ultimate Ground of Being. If Buddha-mind is the ultimate goal but not the Ultimate Ground, it's not a religion.

[ben d]

Originally Posted by lilithu

Recall that this side discussion started when you asserted that "few are chosen."

Ah so, I think I understand...this was in response to Wampus who posted..
"Buddhism is definitely a religion. Occasionally it is a path to liberation also."

So using what I consider to be the Christian equivalent in meaning to that expressed by Wampus, I posted Matthew 22.14. To give more context I provide the preceding text..
'11 And when the king came in to see the guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment: 12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not having a wedding garment? 13 And he was speechless. Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness, there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.'

Please factor into your understanding when doing comparative studies that Christian scripture is not meant to be taken literally but will only reveal the true meaning to those with 'eyes' to see. The gospels are not based on any underlying understanding of reincarnation, whereas Buddhism teaching is, so the language to express a universal principle in one, can be different and most often is in the other.

What this piece from Matthew is telling me is that while everyone is invited to the wedding (Nirvana/liberation), Those without the proper wedding garment (Nirmanakaya vesture) will be cast into outer darkness (reincarnation yet again into the physical world). The concept of a Christian Hell (not that Jesus taught that) is the equivalent of the Buddhist doctrine of continuous reincarnation to the outer physical world until liberation is achieved (salvation)...the wheel of suffering.

[zenzero]

Friends,
Let me put it this way:
I am a being and like others am born in the garden of eden or a place one just lives without any questions or answeres. Naturn takes care of its survival and too besides death and trasformation to another form.
The moment I start to think is the moment I am creating SATAn and differentiating it between god and open a pandoras box or the world of dualities; again when the mind leads me astray and I live in hell try and find means to get back to place in eden BUt the paradox here is that I was there in eden all the time only but the thoughts only made me perceive it differntly.
So humans have found/devised WAYS by following which one can realise the same truth about the fact that he is in eden and these ways we call RELIGION. Buddhism is one of them. Philoshopy is a study and any study uses the very mind which needs to be stilled to get back to eden.
Finally what is important to realise / be enlightened that one is not even a being/ non being.
It is thathagata or suchness.
love & rgds

[TurkeyOnRye]

Like a lot of other posts here, I'd say it depends. Some take it as far as religion, some take the philosophy. I am a skeptic and atheist, but I read heavily into Buddhist philosophy.

[zenzero]

Friend TurkeyOnRye,
When the understanding comes the *I* goes.
The reader of any philosophy too goes.
Only then realisation of what is what comes.
Till then;
All the Best!
Love & rgds

[gnomon]

Originally Posted by Somkid

Is Buddhism a religion?

Yes.

Why?

My in-laws are Buddhist and talk much of their religion. Their many relatives in Cambodia and Thailand, ranging from ethnic Han, Khmer and Thai.....all practice what they call their religion of Buddhism.

There is no point in calling it otherwise.

Religion is not quarantined to a belief in a supreme divinity. You will find far more esoteric spiritual practices that might not fit our definition of religious belief outside the East and West.