Buddism (tradition, Buddhism, doctrine, verse, Buddhism)

[dudley thoth]

" Verily I declare to you my friend, that within this very body, mortal as it is and only an armspan in height but conscious and endowed with mind, is the world and the waxing thereof and the waning thereof and the way that leads to the passing away thereof." Anguttara-nikaya 2

This verse seems to be related to the Trikaya 'Three-body' doctrine, yet seems to predate it (I'm assuming that this is a Thravadan text). Does anyone know anything specifically relating to this text and teaching?

[Master Vigil]

Sounds to me like its discussing the ability for self enlightenment. The ability for the mind, to understand all. Thats what it sounds like. I could be very much wrong.

[Engyo]

Dudley -

I am not sure I get the Trikaya reference here. I think the Nikayas are Thereavadan text, but since my tradition is firmly Mahayana, I don't know the Theravadan stuff that well.

I would call this a restatement of the Four Noble Truths if I were to venture an opinion, but it's only an uneducated opinion.

[dudley thoth]

Originally Posted by Engyo

Dudley -

I am not sure I get the Trikaya reference here. I think the Nikayas are Thereavadan text, but since my tradition is firmly Mahayana, I don't know the Theravadan stuff that well.

I would call this a restatement of the Four Noble Truths if I were to venture an opinion, but it's only an uneducated opinion.

The buddha seems to be talking about the nature (or an aspect) of his body. thats the trikaya connection. It doesn't seem to fit with that particular teaching, but appears to be in some way related. The Buddha seems to be saying that he is (in total) the realm of imperminance. "waxing..waning..etc". Still I'd like something a bit more solid.

[Engyo]

Dudley -

All things are impermanent, are they not? Was the "bit more solid" a pun?

Seriously, I think that what is being referenced here is the fact that enlightenment or awakening is not bestowed on one from outside; it is already within and we practice to become more and more aware of that fact, and to live it. I take this as a way of illustrating to his students not to look outside themselves for the answers. All the world as we know it is a function of our conciousness; without that *none of what I percieve* would exist.

I also don't take it as referring *only* to the Buddha's body - to me it sounds as if he is referring to all sapient life here, not only to *already enlightened* life.

If you are really interested in this I can point you to a place where you can get lots of answers from people much more knowledgeable about the Nikayas than I am.

[dudley thoth]

Originally Posted by Engyo

Dudley -

All things are impermanent, are they not? Was the "bit more solid" a pun?

Chuckle.

I missed that one!

I can almost see the Buddha smiling

If you are really interested in this I can point you to a place where you can get lots of answers from people much more knowledgeable about the Nikayas than I am.

Thanks. I'll probably take you up on that.

[Engyo]

Try http://www.e-sangha.com . It is a board much like this one but devoted to Buddhism (and a bit larger). You can post a question without joining unless you want to.