The Year 1844 (Jesus, priest, ritual, Earth, reincarnate)

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by +Xausted

Sorry that I quoted the wrong person.
What question? I never asked one!

To whit: "What do you believe happened in 1844?"

I know what happened, but I don't think ytou're asking me.

Regards,
Scott

[+Xausted]

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

To whit: "What do you believe happened in 1844?"

I know what happened, but I don't think ytou're asking me.

Regards,
Scott

I never asked that! It was from the OP. Thats why it was written in black and not my trade mark colour purple, and it said above it "zirkr quote ".
The other thing was refaring to who ever said that it foretold in the Bible that people would know, and I was just quoting another passage that says the opposite.
Probably how I wrote it, so sorry for the misunderstanding

[cardero]

Originally Posted by +Xausted

But in 1 Thessalonians 5:2 it states that
“for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.”

stealing thunder no doubt

[Jeremy Mason]

This post should clarify my position concerning the year 1844 and the Second Coming. This Scripture will state that there will be false prophets and that the coming of Jesus will 1) come form the sky. 2) Will come with angels. 3) Everyone in all nations will know about it and will mourn.

There has been no recorded event of such magnitude, which clearly points to a future date and not 1844.

Originally Posted by +Xausted

But in 1 Thessalonians 5:2 it states that
“for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night.”

Yes, it will. But in a very obvious way.

Matthew 24

Signs of the End of the Age

1Jesus left the temple and was walking away when his disciples came up to him to call his attention to its buildings. 2"Do you see all these things?" he asked. "I tell you the truth, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down." 3As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?"

Scott, pay attention.



4Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. 5For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ, and will deceive many. 6You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of birth pains.
9"Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. 10At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, 11and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. 12Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, 13but he who stands firm to the end will be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.
15"So when you see standing in the holy place 'the abomination that causes desolation,' spoken of through the prophet Daniel—let the reader understand— 16then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. 17Let no one on the roof of his house go down to take anything out of the house. 18Let no one in the field go back to get his cloak. 19How dreadful it will be in those days for pregnant women and nursing mothers! 20Pray that your flight will not take place in winter or on the Sabbath. 21For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now—and never to be equaled again. 22If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.



Scott, here it is again.



23At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. 24For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. 25See, I have told you ahead of time.
26"So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. 27For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.



There has been no recorded event of this magnitude.



28Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather.
29"Immediately after the distress of those days
" 'the sun will be darkened,
and the moon will not give its light;
the stars will fall from the sky,
and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.'
30"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory. 31And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.
32"Now learn this lesson from the fig tree: As soon as its twigs get tender and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33Even so, when you see all these things, you know that it is near, right at the door. 34I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 35Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.
The Day and Hour Unknown

36"No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father. 37As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. That is how it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 40Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left. 41Two women will be grinding with a hand mill; one will be taken and the other left. 42"Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come. 43But understand this: If the owner of the house had known at what time of night the thief was coming, he would have kept watch and would not have let his house be broken into. 44So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.

[Popeyesays]

So, to you, Jesus will come down out of the sky observed simulataneously in every degree of lattitude, making such an announcement that no one's faith will be tested and no one will have to stretch their spiritual sense to embrace the event.

How fair is that to the individuals who had the moral and spiritual perspicacity to "put their souls at risk" to believe anyway.

All will be given the proof of Thomas whether they wish to do so or not?

I'm surprised you're not a mormon at this point. THey believe that happened for the people of America between the time that Jesus gave up the spirit on the cross and returned to the Apostles in Palestine on the third day.

To put it simply:
1) The Gospel had been preached unto the nations.

2) The Jews were able to re-settle after almost 2,000 years of enforced exile.

3) The time of Desolation described in Daniel had come to an end.

There had always been 'false prophets'.

The admonition to beware those false claimants was obviously given in the understanding that eventually in the satisfaction of the promises given by Jesus in the first place, that a true Prophet would eventually make the claim.

Welcome to the dilemma of the Pharisees. Who was to be satisfied by the Hand of God writing across the heavens, the new Sanhedrin or the will of God?

Regards,
Scott

[Jeremy Mason]

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

So, to you, Jesus will come down out of the sky observed simulataneously in every degree of lattitude, making such an announcement that no one's faith will be tested and no one will have to stretch their spiritual sense to embrace the event.

That what Jesus said, read it again. One's faith is tested everyday.

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

How fair is that to the individuals who had the moral and spiritual perspicacity to "put their souls at risk" to believe anyway.

I'm not quite sure what your asking here.

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

All will be given the proof of Thomas whether they wish to do so or not?

Blessed are the people who don't see the proof of Thomas and believe.

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

I'm surprised you're not a mormon at this point. THey believe that happened for the people of America between the time that Jesus gave up the spirit on the cross and returned to the Apostles in Palestine on the third day.

Really? I'll have to reference that one.

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

To put it simply:
1) The Gospel had been preached unto the nations.

I'll give you that one even though I'm sure there were still group of people who had no idea about Jesus and what his message was about. Ever read a book called "Peace Child" by Don Richardson?

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

2) The Jews were able to re-settle after almost 2,000 years of enforced exile.

Ummm....!844 and 1947. Your a 100 years off.

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

3) The time of Desolation described in Daniel had come to an end.

Read this
What is the abomination of desolation?

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

There had always been 'false prophets'.

You got that one right. Meatloaf said, "2 out of 3 aint bad", but 2 out of 10?

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

The admonition to beware those false claimants was obviously given in the understanding that eventually in the satisfaction of the promises given by Jesus in the first place, that a true Prophet would eventually make the claim.

Where in the Bible does it say that, Scott?

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

Welcome to the dilemma of the Pharisees. Who was to be satisfied by the Hand of God writing across the heavens, the new Sanhedrin or the will of God?

I see what your saying, but Jesus clearly states the conditions of the Second Coming and to not be fooled into thinking that another man would in any way be Jesus. Jesus will come the way he left and not from two parents here on earth.

[arthra]

I think the "false prophets" charge though mertioned in scripture refer to those already in the early Church ...

The false prophet charge is a common one though..

I suppose the Pharisees levelled it against Jesus when they referred to Him as using demons to cast out demons..or called Him a wine bibber because He associated with the wrong crowd..

- Art

[Popeyesays]

To say "Beware false Prophets!" is to admit the corollary, Jeremy.

I know what the abmonination of desolation is qne iw not, the article you cite is superficial at best, and down right wrong at worst.

The Book of Daniel not only defines the Abmonation of Desolation as beginning with the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD, but also defines the first abmoniation of the Temple before the Babylonian captivity.

I read your citation, dutifully, will you do the same for me?

Some Answered Questions, Pages 35-44

When you've finished that, you will understand where I am coming from when discussing the Abomination of Desolation, and we will have a common ground for further discussion.

Regards,
Scott

[Halcyon]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Mason

I see what your saying, but Jesus clearly states the conditions of the Second Coming and to not be fooled into thinking that another man would in any way be Jesus. Jesus will come the way he left and not from two parents here on earth.

That's a good point. If you believe in the orthodox understanding as depicted in the Bible, Jesus was raised into Heaven bodily, it would be quite unnecessary for him to shed that body and reincarnate.

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Halcyon

That's a good point. If you believe in the orthodox understanding as depicted in the Bible, Jesus was raised into Heaven bodily, it would be quite unnecessary for him to shed that body and reincarnate.

It's not a matter of ascent and descent. The Spirit of God remains in heaven aoways, even when it is here on eart, and it isw here on earth always even when it is in heaven--there is no spritual elevator, there is no bilocation involved.

Gleanings, pp. 46-47
XIX: To every discerning and illuminated heart it... "1To every discerning and illuminated heart it is evident that God, the unknowable Essence, the Divine Being, is immensely exalted beyond every human attribute, such as corporeal existence, ascent and descent, egress and regress. Far be it from His glory that human tongue should adequately recount His praise, or that human heart comprehend His fathomless mystery. He is, and hath ever been, veiled in the ancient eternity of His Essence, and will remain in His Reality everlastingly hidden from the sight of men. "No vision taketh in Him, but He taketh in all vision; He is the Subtile, the All-Perceiving."...
2The door of the knowledge of the Ancient of Days being thus closed in the face of all beings, the Source of infinite grace, according to His saying, "His grace hath transcended all things; My grace hath encompassed them all," hath caused those luminous Gems of Holiness to appear out of the realm of the spirit, in the noble form of the human temple, and be made manifest unto all men, that they may impart unto the world the mysteries of the unchangeable Being, and tell of the subtleties of His imperishable Essence.
3These sanctified Mirrors, these Day Springs of ancient glory, are, one and all, the Exponents on earth of Him Who is the central Orb of the universe, its Essence and ultimate Purpose. From Him proceed their knowledge and power; from Him is derived their sovereignty. The beauty of their countenance is but a reflection of His image, and their revelation a sign of His deathless glory. They are the Treasuries of Divine knowledge, and the Repositories of celestial wisdom. Through them is transmitted a grace that is infinite, and by them is revealed the Light that can never fade.... These Tabernacles of Holiness, these Primal Mirrors which reflect the light of unfading glory, are but expressions of Him Who is the Invisible of the Invisibles. By the revelation of these Gems of Divine virtue all the names and attributes of God, such as knowledge and power, sovereignty and dominion, mercy and wisdom, glory, bounty, and grace, are made manifest."

Regards,
Scott