contradictions in the bible??? (Jesus, moral, punishment, Moses, Earth)

[SaveMeJebus]

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Katszpur provided me with what she claims are contradictions in the bible. I wish to disprove all of them with God's help and mercy


Which did God create first -- man or beast? Genesis 1 contradicts Genesis 2:

Genesis 1:25-26 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Genesis 2:18-19 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

What is the value of wisdom? Proverbs describes wisdom in one way and Ecclesiastes in a completely opposite way:

Proverbs 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

Ecclesiastes 1:18 For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.

Did God tell Moses that killing was wrong? That depends upon which book you read.

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.

Numbers 31:17-18 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

Can God be seen or not? There are many contradictory verses on this subject, among them these, which say He can:

Exodus 33:11 And the Lord spake to Moses face to face, as a man speaketh to his friend.

Genesis 32:30 For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

And these which say He can't:

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time.

Exodus 33:20 And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for there shall no man see me and live.

Does God temp man? Genesis says yes; James says no.

Genesis 22:1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham."

James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God; for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man.

Who has been to heaven? 2 Kings says Elijah was, but John says only Christ has.

2 Kings 2:11 And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

John 3:13 No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, ... the Son of Man.

Do we all sin?

Ecclesiastes 7:20 For there is not a just man upon earth, that doeth good, and sinneth not.

1 John 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

How should we respond to the fool, by answering him or ignoring him?

Proverbs 26:4 Answer not a fool according to his folly, lest thou also be like unto him.

Proverbs 26:5 Answer a fool according to his folly, lest he be wise in his own conceit.

When Saul/Paul was converted, did those who were with him hear anyone? One chapter of Acts says yes; another says no.

Acts 9:7 And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man.

Acts 22:9 And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me.

Should we make others aware of our good deeds? One chapter in Matthew says we should; another says we shouldn't.

Matthew 5:16 In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.

Matthew 6:3-4 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secert. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

Are we responsible for bearing our own burdens or not?

Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Galatians 6:5 For every man shall bear his own burden.

Who is for Jesus? Who is against Him?

Matthew 12:30 He that is not with me is against me.

Luke 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.

still no proof just a bunch of old poetry to me and why does god say create man in OUR image!as in multiple people are with him.

[Sola'lor]

Originally Posted by SaveMeJebus

still no proof just a bunch of old poetry to me and why does god say create man in OUR image!as in multiple people are with him.

Because we all lived with God as Spirits before we came to the Earth. Also Heavenly Father created the Earth through Jesus Christ. That could explain the 'our.'

[Sola'lor]

Here's some more for discussion. Unless they have been already discussed. I would like to see your rationalizations of these(emphasis added):

How many stalls for horses did Solomon have?
1 Kings 4: 26 ¶ And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.

2 chronicles 9:25 ¶ And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.


How many overseers did Solomon appoint for the work of building the temple?
2 Chronicles 2:2 And Solomon told out threescore and ten thousand men to bear burdens, and fourscore thousand to hew in the mountain, and three thousand and six hundred to oversee them.

1 Kings 5:16 Beside the chief of Solomon’s officers which were over the work, three thousand and three hundred, which ruled over the people that wrought in the work.

Solomon built a facility containing how many baths?
1 Kings 7:26 And it was an hand breadth thick, and the brim thereof was wrought like the brim of a cup, with flowers of lilies: it contained two thousand baths.

2 Chronicles 4:5 And the thickness of it was an handbreadth, and the brim of it like the work of the brim of a cup, with flowers of lilies; and it received and held three thousand baths.

Of the Israelites who were freed from the Babylonian captivity, how many were the children of Pahrath-Moab?
Ezra 2:6 The children of Pahath-moab, of the children of Jeshua and Joab, two thousand eight hundred and twelve.

Nehemiah 7:11 The children of Pahath-moab, of the children of Jeshua and Joab, two thousand and eight hundred and eighteen.

How many were the children of Zattu?
Ezra 2:88 The children of Zattu, nine hundred forty and five.

Nehemiah 7:13 The children of Zattu, eight hundred forty and five.

How many were the children of Azgad?
Ezra 2:12 The children of Azgad, a thousand two hundred twenty and two.

Nehemiah 7:17 The children of Azgad, two thousand three hundred twenty and two.

How many were the children of Adin?
Ezra 2:15 The children of Adin, four hundred fifty and four.

Nehemiah 7:20 The children of Adin, six hundred fifty and five.

How many were the children of Hashum?
Ezra 2:19 The children of Hashum, two hundred twenty and three.

Nehemiah 7:22 The children of Hashum, three hundred twenty and eight.

How many were the children of Bethel and Ai?
Ezra 2:28 The men of Beth-el and Ai, two hundred twenty and three.

Nehemiah 7:32 The men of Beth-el and Ai, an hundred twenty and three.

Ezra 2:64 and Nehemiah 7:66 agree that the total number of the whole assembly was 42,360. Yet the numbers do not add up to anything close. The totals obtained from each book is as follows:
Ezra = 29,818

Nehemiah = 31,089

How many singers accompanied the assembly?
Ezra 2:65 Beside their servants and their maids, of whom there were seven thousand three hundred thirty and seven: and there were among them two hundred singing men and singing women.

Nehemiah 7:67 Beside their manservants and their maidservants, of whom there were seven thousand three hundred thirty and seven: and they had two hundred forty and five singing men and singing women.

How did Judas die?
Matthew 27:5 And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

Acts 1:18 Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

[Ringer]

Originally Posted by Mestemia

Matt 13:31-32:

"the kingdom of heaven is like to a grain of mustard seed which…is the least of all seeds, but when it is grown is the greatest among herbs and becometh a tree."

There are 2 significant errors here: first, there are many smaller seeds, like the orchid seed; and second, mustard plants don't grow into trees.

It sounds like you are reading this passage with a narrow mind and not trying to understand what Jesus was trying to communicate.

[Mestemia]

Originally Posted by Ringer

It sounds like you are reading this passage with a narrow mind and not trying to understand what Jesus was trying to communicate.

Thats it?
Two glaring factual errors and all you can come up with is "you are missing the point of the passage"?
Now I understand why so many Christians have no problem using falsities, lies, and blatant dishonesty when recruiting new members or whilst flaming other denominations.

[Ringer]

Originally Posted by Mestemia

Thats it?
Two glaring factual errors and all you can come up with is "you are missing the point of the passage"?
Now I understand why so many Christians have no problem using falsities, lies, and blatant dishonesty when recruiting new members or whilst flaming other denominations.

I believe Jesus understood that those in his audience were not botanologists. As a result, he chose a seed that they could relate to. Using mustard as an example was probably of significance because, like salt, it gave flavor to food. The fact that Jesus recognized that mustard was an herb meant that he knew that it was in fact a shrub and not a tree. However, the kingdom of heaven is so great that even though it started as a shrub, it didn't stop there but kept growing into a tree. So much so that it was large enough to offer protection. Trees growing to great heights and being described as we see here are used a few times in the OT for much of the same reason as I just described. This is just my interpretation but it seems to make sense given the fact that Jesus understood the OT quite well.

[Ratiocinative]

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Katszpur provided me with what she claims are contradictions in the bible. I wish to disprove all of them with God's help and mercy

It's always fun to prove Katzpur wrong, I volunteer!

The first thing to be aware of is that Mormons use the KJV version of the Bible. There’s nothing inherently wrong with KJV, but it is 400 years old, and, believe it or not, language changes a bit in 400 years. I’m guessing that many of these supposed contradictions are nothing more than subtle difference is word meaning before I even look at them. That’s what you get for reading a 400 year old language.

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Which did God create first -- man or beast? Genesis 1 contradicts Genesis 2:

Genesis 1:25-26 And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Genesis 2:18-19 And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Perhaps read the entire chapter?:

Genesis 2:18-21 (NASB)
18Then the LORD God said, "It is not good for the man to be alone; (S)I will make him a helper suitable for him." 19 Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name. 20The man gave names to all the cattle, and to the birds of the sky, and to every beast of the field, but for Adam there was not found a helper suitable for him. 21So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place.

It is merely describing the predicament Adam was in. It says God has created all the animals, introduced them to Adam and Adam gave them all names, but there was no suitable helper for Adam.

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

What is the value of wisdom? Proverbs describes wisdom in one way and Ecclesiastes in a completely opposite way:

Proverbs 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

Ecclesiastes 1:18 For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.

I guess this is one that I’m not 100% sure about, but it seems to be that proverbs is saying that wisdom will help you make good decisions and be prosperous in life, while Ecclesiastes is saying that as you acquire more wisdom the more you realize how foolish and futile the ways of men are. Certainly not a contradiction though.

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Did God tell Moses that killing was wrong? That depends upon which book you read.

Exodus 20:13 Thou shalt not kill.

Numbers 31:17-18 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.

The 6th commandment is do not murder, not do not kill. Do not kill is an incorrect translation. Murder means to kill without just cause, against the law. Killing in circumstances such as self-defense, punishment for crime, war, and such are not sins. The punishment for sin

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Can God be seen or not? There are many contradictory verses on this subject, among them these, which say He can:

Exodus 33:11 And the Lord spake to Moses face to face, as a man speaketh to his friend.

Genesis 32:30 For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.

And these which say He can't:

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time.

Exodus 33:20 And he said, Thou canst not see my face; for there shall no man see me and live.

The phrase “face to face” in Hebrew just means that there was a personal relationship between Moses and God, which at the time was a very foreign idea to Jews. God didn’t just say “Hey Moses go tell the Israelites to do such and such”. He actually had conversations with him about things. It doesn’t mean that God took human form to talk to Moses.

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Does God temp man? Genesis says yes; James says no.

Genesis 22:1 And it came to pass after these things, that God did tempt Abraham."

James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God; for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man.

The correct translation is tested for Gen 22:1, not tempted.

http://htmlbible.com/sacrednamebible...EB52.htm#S5254

Originally Posted by uss_bigd

Who has been to heaven? 2 Kings says Elijah was, but John says only Christ has.

2 Kings 2:11 And Elijah went up by a whirlwind into heaven.

John 3:13 No man hath ascended up to heaven but he that came down from heaven, ... the Son of Man.

There are three different “heavens”, as the Jews called it: Sky, outer space, and the Heaven where God lives. The “heaven” that Elijah went up to is a different word than the word used for the Heaven where
God dwells. It just means that Elijah went into the sky.

http://htmlbible.com/sacrednamebible...EB80.htm#S8064