God is omnipresent and Omniscient, is concept biblical??? (Jesus, ritual)

[uss_bigd]

[quote=Mister Emu;1134612] Also, read Psalm 139:7 quote]


Hebrews 13:5
Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, "Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you."

The context of David in Psalms 139:7 is similar to the verse above. but it does not mean that God will also be in place where David is not going to Go. God will be where David Goes IF HE GOES THERE

Psalms 139:8-9

8 If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, [a] you are there. 9 If I rise on the wings of the dawn,
if I settle on the far side of the sea,

Another thing, presence may not be literal presence sir. however, dwelling requires presence at least for a time.

look at the dictionary defintion

Dwell = to remain for a time

1. Acts 7:48
   Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
2. Acts 17:24
   God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;

Therefore Mister Emu, if God does not Dwell in temples made with human hands, he does not stay in temples made by human hands even for a time. not even for a time. so? how can he be everywhere?

Another thing, God can't be in prostitution dens, strip clubs, my toilet, casinos and whereever there is envy and strife.

Have a nice day Sir!

[gnostic]

Originally Posted by mr emu

I often ask my neices and nephews questions about what they've done that I already know the answers too... It is to give them a chance to tell me on their own.

Be that it may with your kids, there is no indication that God knew what was happening. You only making assumption that God was asking rhetorical questions.

Something happened, and God was asking question. If God did know then the questions would have been quite different.

It would make more sense if the story was told where God knew the answer, and that he immediately ask Adam something like this - "Why did you eat the fruit, which I forbid you to eat?" But instead he ask the questions in the Genesis with a "where", "who", and "did", which made it sound like he was clueless.

So I am seriously not buying your lines of thought, Mr Emu.

[uss_bigd]

Originally Posted by gnostic

Be that it may with your kids, there is no indication that God knew what was happening. You only making assumption that God was asking rhetorical questions.

Something happened, and God was asking question. If God did know then the questions would have been quite different.

It would make more sense if the story was told where God knew the answer, and that he immediately ask Adam something like this - "Why did you eat the fruit, which I forbid you to eat?" But instead he ask the questions in the Genesis with a "where", "who", and "did", which made it sound like he was clueless.

So I am seriously not buying your lines of thought, Mr Emu.

No comments on my post gnostic? frubals maybe?

[gnostic]

Looking at the gospels as an example, from what I can gather, someone had to betray Jesus in order for Jesus' death and resurrection to happen.

If it was Judas Iscariot was destined to be the betrayer from the moment of birth, then he could not possibly alter his position of being the betrayer. That being the case, then wouldn't it mean that Judas had no free will in the matter?

And if I wrong then please correct me, because I am only recalling the event from memory, because I don't have bible with me. When Jesus pass the bit of food to Judas to reveal who would betray him, didn't a spirit entered into Judas and caused his action that led to Jesus' arrest?

If this so, then the action is not really Judas, is it not? The spirit guided Judas to accept the blood money, that led to Judas kissing Jesus to show the guards who to arrest. Again, that would mean Judas had no free will.

So think of it this way. If our every-day actions were guided by spirits, then wouldn't that mean none of us have free will?

[uss_bigd]

Originally Posted by gnostic

Looking at the gospels as an example, from what I can gather, someone had to betray Jesus in order for Jesus' death and resurrection to happen.

If it was Judas Iscariot was destined to be the betrayer from the moment of birth, then he could not possibly alter his position of being the betrayer. That being the case, then wouldn't it mean that Judas had no free will in the matter?

And if I wrong then please correct me, because I am only recalling the event from memory, because I don't have bible with me. When Jesus pass the bit of food to Judas to reveal who would betray him, didn't a spirit entered into Judas and caused his action that led to Jesus' arrest?

If this so, then the action is not really Judas, is it not? The spirit guided Judas to accept the blood money, that led to Judas kissing Jesus to show the guards who to arrest. Again, that would mean Judas had no free will.

No frubals for me i guess.

I have to review that to be honest...

Are you arguing that there is no free will then? I mean everyone doesn't have one?
or do you mean Judas alone didn't have free will?

how about the other post about "God not being everywhre" ? dont i deserve a frubal for that?

[crystalonyx]

Isn't it odd that they would needed Judas anyway, since the supposed Jesus was a well-known preacher around Jerusalem, he should have been reconizable on sight. This story was another one made up merely to fulfill prophecy.

[gnostic]

Well, it would seem that David was destined to become king, and only the way that could happen is to remove Saul. If no spirit was there torment Saul to madness and paranoid, could Saul live and rule longer than the book of Samuel indicated?

Who sent the evil spirit? God. And it is this which led to Saul's downfall.

It is God playing favoritism. If you believe in prophecies at such found in the bible, then God is like the puppet-master controlling all the puppets. The puppets can have no control or action of its own.

Originally Posted by us_bigd

Are you arguing that there is no free will then? I mean everyone doesn't have one?
or do you mean Judas alone didn't have free will?

No. I have no idea if we have free will or not. No idea if we have destiny or not. No idea if God is omnipresent or omniscient.

I am only using your bible, and try to get perspective of the context of some of the verses found. I see this passage or that passage, and then I question it. Does it mean this or does it mean that?

I see no sign of this omnipresent or omniscient of God in these texts. I do see signs where Judas seem to have no free will, when you take the passages into context.

[uss_bigd]

Originally Posted by gnostic

Well, it would seem that David was destined to become king, and only the way that could happen is to remove Saul. If no spirit was there torment Saul to madness and paranoid, could Saul live and rule longer than the book of Samuel indicated?

Who sent the evil spirit? God. And it is this which led to Saul's downfall.

It is God playing favoritism. If you believe in prophecies at such found in the bible, then God is like the puppet-master controlling all the puppets. The puppets can have no control or action of its own.



No. I have no idea if we have free will or not. No idea if we have destiny or not. No idea if God is omnipresent or omniscient.

I am only using your bible, and try to get perspective of the context of some of the verses found. I see this passage or that passage, and then I question it. Does it mean this or does it mean that?

I see no sign of this omnipresent or omniscient of God in these texts. I do see signs where Judas seem to have no free will, when you take the passages into context.

I will agree with you with one thing, The God of the bible is niether Omniscient nor omnipresent. That is what i am trying to prove in this Thread.

[Mister Emu]

If God is everywhere, as other religions claim, the Bible should not have said that the eyes of the Lord are in every place. It will contradict the law of logic. Does it mean that the eyes of God, His very eyes, are everywhere? Of course, not! His eyes are in His being; but can see even beyond the material universe we know.

As you previously pointed out, God is spirit, not flesh. He doesn't have "eyes" to be everywhere. It is a phrase to mean that He sees everything.

God is not in a place where there are evil strife and envy.

He is not where confusion dwells.

Those verses do not say these things...

In the casinos? The prostitution dens? In the place of demons?

Yes. Yes. Yes.

Now, the meaning of this verse is that, Jesus knew from the begining who has CHOSEN not to beleive in him. But my stance is God cannot know what is in your heart BEFORE you have decided

I don't necessarily disagree, except that since I believe that God is eternally present(present throughout all time) that God already knows what you will decide because He has already seen you decide it.

The context of David in Psalms 139:7 is similar to the verse above. but it does not mean that God will also be in place where David is not going to Go. God will be where David Goes IF HE GOES THERE

I don't agree. David did not say, If I go there you will follow me, he says, "you are there".

Therefore Mister Emu, if God does not Dwell in temples made with human hands, he does not stay in temples made by human hands even for a time. not even for a time

I know this to not be the case, as He has been there everytime I go to Church...

Be that it may with your kids, there is no indication that God knew what was happening.

Biblically, this is not the case, as Biblically God knows everything we do.

If it was Judas Iscariot was destined to be the betrayer from the moment of birth, then he could not possibly alter his position of being the betrayer.

He was not predestined to betray, he chose to do so...

When Jesus pass the bit of food to Judas to reveal who would betray him, didn't a spirit entered into Judas and caused his action that led to Jesus' arrest?

In John... but before the devil enters into Judas, Judas has already made up his mind to betray Jesus.