War in heaven? (Earth, Revelation, Christianity, Satan, God)

[lockyfan]

Originally Posted by Francine

If St. John said the things in the book of Revelation were "soon to come to pass" and if the War in Heaven (with the dragon who was cast down to Earth along with 1/3 of the angels) is in the book of Revelation, does that mean when John wrote his book that Satan had yet to be cast down to Earth?

At that point in time, there had been no war in heaven

Originally Posted by Katzpur

I believe that Revelation is mostly prophesy, but not entirely. I believe the War in Heaven has already taken place.

yes the war has taken place, but not in his day. In 1914

Originally Posted by Sola'lor

Well if Satan isn't here now tempting us, then I wonder who is?

satan is the one who rules earth
1 John 5:19
the whole world is lying in the [power of the] wicked one.

Originally Posted by Katzpur

But not everyone believes that Lucifer and Satan are one and the same, Sola.

I know but why?

by the way Satan and Devil mean Opposer and Slanderer respectively

Originally Posted by Azakel

Kind of off topic but. Lucifer is a being that has no roots in Christianity to begin with and Satan is just Ha-Satan with out the Ha that is the title of the Angel that had the job of testing Gods people. Though I don't believe the Christian to be an all power God that people say he is doesn't mean I don't find thing about it fun to learn. I like learning about Angels. Interesting beings.

Where did you get the idea of a Angel allowed to test God's people?

Originally Posted by vandervalley

this "war in heaven" can only prove one thing.

There are many gods in heaven and sometimes they fight each other to gain influence.

This also show that in heaven; there are still greed and other bad habits you find on earth

I know where you get this kind of idea from, satan himself. Because satan wanted to be a God and he anted to rule over everything, so he challenged the real one and what happened. Revelation tells us, he is sent out of heaven and will soon be destroyed. that is the only God that is showing "greed and other bad habits" you find on this earth
see above quote from 1 John 5:19

Originally Posted by Prophet of God

The War in Heaven has already taken place. But Satan did not stay on the earth. He lost his place of athority. But he still is before the trone making accusations against humanity.

Yes it has already take place, but satan is on the earth. how do we know? Well the world wouldn't be this bad if he wasn't here making it a huge total and utter mess.

Originally Posted by sojourner

Wouldn't our time be better spent concerning ourselves with the wars on earth? I wonder how much of the Revelation accounts are speculative and metaphorical, not actual recorded "future history?"

A Lot of the things in the beginning of revelation (the talking to the congregations) are telling us what we should be like if we are wanting to take part in his Kingdom, the paths and ways we should follow.
Also we are living part of revelation no, you see the war in heaven has taken place and now we are awaiting the destruction of babylon the great. that is where we are, when you look at revelation awaiting the destruction of babylon the Great.
So no it is not best to be concerning our time looking at the wars on earth, as the one in heaven has occurred and there is not much time left before his destruction

[Azakel]

Originally Posted by lockyfan

Where did you get the idea of a Angel allowed to test God's people?

Judaism. Where Satan came from.
Here is a site by a follower of the Jewish faith. I think he would know better about Satan an Angel of his God then most Christians.
Does Judaism Believe in Satan?

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by lockyfan

yes the war has taken place, but not in his day. In 1914

Not in whose day? Lucifer was cast out of heaven as a result of his role as leader of the rebellion that preceded the creation of our earth. He has been tempting people here on earth since long before 1914.

[gnostic]

Surely Satan and his followers knew that they couldn't possibly win a war against God and his host. So I don't understand how could Satan think of going to war.

It is simply illogical to fight a war that is impossible to win. And you would think that Satan would be smarter than that.

This is just my perspective in the literary about the war in war; it's not I believe such a war took place.

[newcastle]

Originally Posted by vandervalley

this "war in heaven" can only prove one thing.

There are many gods in heaven and sometimes they fight each other to gain influence.

This also show that in heaven; there are still greed and other bad habits you find on earth

They don't stay there for long!!

2En,29- 2And from the rock I cut off a great fire, and from the fire I
created the orders of the incorporeal ten troops of angels, and their
weapons are fiery and their raiment a burning flame, and I commanded
that each one should stand in his order.

3And one from out the order of angels, having turned away with the order
that was under him, conceived an impossible thought, to place his throne
higher than the clouds above the earth, that he might become equal in
rank to my power.

4And I threw him out from the height with his angels, and he was flying in
the air continuously above the bottomless.

[Darkness]

Originally Posted by Francine

If St. John said the things in the book of Revelation were "soon to come to pass" and if the War in Heaven (with the dragon who was cast down to Earth along with 1/3 of the angels) is in the book of Revelation, does that mean when John wrote his book that Satan had yet to be cast down to Earth?

I was under the impression the war broke out when Jesus was born.

[newcastle]

Originally Posted by Sola'lor

Well if Satan isn't here now tempting us, then I wonder who is?

Here be your answer!

1En, 10 -13 To Gabriel the Lord said, Go to the offspring of the Watchers, bring them
forth, and excite them one against another. Let them perish by mutual slaughter;
for length of days shall not be theirs. 1En 15 - 8 Now the giants, who have been born
of spirit and of flesh, shall be called upon earth evil spirits, and on earth shall be their
habitation. 9The spirits of the giants shall be like clouds, (25) which shall oppress,
corrupt, fall, content, and bruise upon earth.

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by gnostic

Surely Satan and his followers knew that they couldn't possibly win a war against God and his host. So I don't understand how could Satan think of going to war.

It is simply illogical to fight a war that is impossible to win. And you would think that Satan would be smarter than that.

Let's talk about this a little bit more. What exactly do you believe the war was about? If Satan was trying to convince his followers of something, what was it? And who were his followers?

[Darkness]

Originally Posted by Newcastle

1En, 10 -13 To Gabriel the Lord said, Go to the offspring of the Watchers, bring them
forth, and excite them one against another. Let them perish by mutual slaughter;
for length of days shall not be theirs. 1En 15 - 8 Now the giants, who have been born
of spirit and of flesh, shall be called upon earth evil spirits, and on earth shall be their
habitation. 9The spirits of the giants shall be like clouds, (25) which shall oppress,
corrupt, fall, content, and bruise upon earth.

An interesting explanation for the origin of demons.

[newcastle]

Originally Posted by Sola'lor

Well if Satan isn't here now tempting us, then I wonder who is?

[quote=lockyfan;1114506]At that point in time, there had been no war in heaven

satan is the one who rules earth
1 John 5:19
the whole world is lying in the [power of the] wicked one.

Because satan wanted to be a God and he anted to rule over everything, so he challenged the real one and what happened. Revelation tells us, he is sent out of heaven and will soon be destroyed. that is the only God that is showing "greed and other bad habits" you find on this earth

Yes it has already take place, but satan is on the earth. how do we know? Well the world wouldn't be this bad if he wasn't here making it a huge total and utter mess.

Also we are living part of revelation no, you see the war in heaven has taken place and now we are awaiting the destruction of babylon the great.
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Satan Doesn’t Rule In Hell Or On Earth… Satan Is In A Prison!

2En,7- 1 And those men took me and led me up on to the second
heaven, and showed me darkness, greater than earthly darkness, and
there I saw prisoners hanging and these angels were dark-looking. These
are God’s apostates, who obeyed not God’s commands, but took counsel
with their own will, and turned away with their prince, who also is
fastened on the fifth heaven.

The verse above depicts of the prison where the 200 Rebel Angels await
for judgment. These are the ones who took council of themselves and
approached the daughters of men who begot their offspring the giants.

2En,18- 1 The men took me on to the fifth heaven and placed me, and
there I saw many and countless soldiers, called Grigori, of human
appearance, and their size was greater than that of great giants and their
faces withered.

3 And they said to me: These are the Grigori, who with their prince
Satanail rejected the Lord of light, and after them are those who are held
in great darkness on the second heaven.