Unfulfilled Prophecies in the Bible (Jesus, ritual, Jehovah, genesis)

[JerryL]

You didn't get what I was saying. Quite twisting my words. I said that differing books containing history within the Bible contain slightly differing accounts.

Incomplatable accounts which establish at least one account as wrong.

Do you discredit any American history writers just because they disagree about minor points with British ones?

I lend a weight of credence based on consensus with disparant sources. I do believe, for example, the Biblical claim that Judea was occupied and run by the Romans in the time of the NT.

No. The truth behind the Bible is theological truth. Now, the books of the Bible may certainly be trusted as historically accurate on a macro scale, but to pinpoint
exactly how many troups a person has or the color of one person's robe is demanding of the text a level of acute accuracy that it does not claim for itself.

Really? What accuracy does it claim for itself? In what passage? I thought the entire thing was "God breathed".

You agree that there are inaccuracies in the Bible. We know it's not a perfect text. Now let's see your support for what you claim to be accurate, to actually be accurate.

Bible is not wrong, it is simply that two authors writing down historical information put down two slightly varying accounts.

The BIble says that Jesus's robe was Purple. It also says the same robe was scarlet. One of those accounts is wrong. Since both are in the Bible, the Bible is wrong. It's pretty simple.

The point is in all of the instances you mentioned above that the larger story be told, not all of its minute details. Judas killed himself at Akel Dama, regardless of method; Jesus wore a robe, regardless of color.

Both stories match that Jesus wore a robe, though at least one is wrong in describing it. It's possible both are wrong in there being one at all.

That's your problem. Since they are functionally same-source (recall that most of the gospels were written by non-witnesses), while I can prove that somethings are wrong, we cannot prove that the others are right.

We can, however, see that the Bible itself is not inerrant because it contains errors. Not "God breathed" after all.

[Of a Happy Ending]

Originally Posted by JerryL

Incomplatable accounts which establish at least one account as wrong.

I lend a weight of credence based on consensus with disparant sources. I do believe, for example, the Biblical claim that Judea was occupied and run by the Romans in the time of the NT.

Really? What accuracy does it claim for itself? In what passage? I thought the entire thing was "God breathed".

You agree that there are inaccuracies in the Bible. We know it's not a perfect text. Now let's see your support for what you claim to be accurate, to actually be accurate.

The BIble says that Jesus's robe was Purple. It also says the same robe was scarlet. One of those accounts is wrong. Since both are in the Bible, the Bible is wrong. It's pretty simple.

Both stories match that Jesus wore a robe, though at least one is wrong in describing it. It's possible both are wrong in there being one at all.

That's your problem. Since they are functionally same-source (recall that most of the gospels were written by non-witnesses), while I can prove that somethings are wrong, we cannot prove that the others are right.

We can, however, see that the Bible itself is not inerrant because it contains errors. Not "God breathed" after all.

I like your little allusion to II Tim 3:6 there. In any case, we have to then determine what "God breathed" means. Theologians have been debating it for centuries. Is the Bible verbally inspired? Is it conceptually inspired? Are the actual words the words of God or are the truths behind the words the truths of God? How picky can we be with the words of the Bible in determining Inspiration? You have opened a huge can of worms with this one.

Personally, I have come to the conclusion that the truth of the Bible is the inspired Word of God, not the words themselves. We come into a lot of problems when we begin to state that the very words are inspired by God. Rather, God had something that He wanted to say through men. The problem there is that He did it through men.

The memories of men obviously deteriorate, and what one remembers as scarlet another will remember as purple. When one remembers 10,000 another will remember 9,000. Where one adheres to the story that Judas died by hanging himself, another will inevitably accept that Judas died by falling "headlong" in a field. The gospels are compiled accounts written down from the memories of men. However, Inspiration does not apply to the words written in the gospel, rather to the truth of the story itself.

Brandon

[blood-lord14]

TimeCube hasn't happened yet...
anyone wonder if it counts as words of blasphemy?

[Yasin]

Originally Posted by Of a Happy Ending

Here's the problem. You're reading literally what was figurative.

1. The claim is figurative in the sense of time. Adam and Eve were eternal creatures until eating of the forbidden fruit. At that time they became subject to death. The verse that you claim refutes the "threat" actually fulfills it. The latter part of the verse states, "then he died." Adam would not have died at all had he not taken of the fruit.

2. After partaking of the fruit, the fellowship that Adam and Eve had with God was broken, amounting to spiritual death. Romans tells us that "the wages of sin is death." If taken literally, we should all die at the first sign of sin. However, the verse refers to spiritual death. We are all separated from God, and are, therefore, spiritually dead. That life is only restored through the absolution of our sin.

3. Satan was not more accurate than God, only more scheming. He knew that Adam and Eve would not immediately physically die, but he certainly knew that breaking God's command would result in a broken fellowship, and once one has been in the immediate presence of God, to suddenly be faced with never again having that degree of fellowship must be a type of death.

There ya' go.

Brandon

What puzzles me is that when it comes to the Divinity of Jesus Christ (pbuh), "it is literal", but when other issues, which are hard to accept, are addressed "it is figurative"
Sons of God are mentioned in the OT, but are not taken literally.
Where do we stop with our interpretations?
Does it get to the point were the meanings are lost?

Respectively, Yasin

[JerryL]

The memories of men obviously deteriorate, and what one remembers as scarlet another will remember as purple. When one remembers 10,000 another will remember 9,000. Where one adheres to the story that Judas died by hanging himself, another will inevitably accept that Judas died by falling "headlong" in a field.

So facts become legends; the prophet becomes God; myths of a resurrection become asserted as facts; armies of zombie-saints appear in one recollection, and some imagine wise-men giving gifts.

In fact, the Gods of genesis become the God of Exodus become the frgamented God of the NT. The blood-god of the OT because the loving God of the gospels becomes the beuocratic God of Paul.

The Bible is written by people who we know wrote wrong things. How do you decide which parts you believe anyway?

[angellous_evangellous]

The fulfillment of prophesy can only be interpreted by a prophet.

[Deut 13:1]

Originally Posted by Suzy

So when Adam died at 930 years, then it was within Gods day of one thousand years.

Judaism holds that Adam gave 70 years of his life to King David, but I guess if we ignore Duet 13, then we're all right...

[Yasin]

Originally Posted by Duet 13:1-6

Judaism holds that Adam gave 70 years of his life to King David, but I guess if we ignore Duet 13, then we're all right...

Interesting!
Jews to the rescue!

[Yasin]

Originally Posted by angellous_evangellous

The fulfillment of prophesy can only be interpreted by a prophet.

Well show us a Prophet who is ready to interpret for us, or are all the prophesies condemned to mystery?

Respectively, Yasin

[mormonman]

Originally Posted by Yasin

Well show us a Prophet who is ready to interpret for us, or are all the prophesies condemned to mystery?

Respectively, Yasin

Gordon B. Hinkley-prophet, seer, and revelator. President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints