Animals, a soul, and free will (Jesus, moral, Creator, Earth)

[Druidus]

Actually, the bible clearly says they were given a soul. I was taught that they had one too, back in confirmation class (I used to be catholic).

[Ardhanariswar]

ooo, and the debate gets thicker.

this is all according to the bible right? what if the bible is wrong? but no, that cannot be.

[Feathers in Hair]

Originally Posted by HelpMe

animals don't have spirits(according to the 'bible')

Ah, then I'll have to disagree, if that's what the Bible says. I have spoken with their spirits, as they have with mine. To say otherwise would be like coming into a party, along with ten other people, and telling the host "I'm so glad you invited me!"

[G.A.]

The capacities of the animals to relate to God is not the same as humans. I have seen humans used by God's power to heal the blind, deaf, parapelegic, AIDS, even raise the dead, but I have never seen an animal do these things.

[Druidus]

I have spoken with their spirits, as they have with mine.

Really? Which? I don't want to sound crazy, but I have merged conciousness with a tree, and am trying to do the same with a bird (raven) using druidic meditation.

And to the above poster-

Have you truly "seen" this? If so, who did it? It wasn't a tv evangelist was it? If it wasn't, that's pretty amazing. How come it's not on the news? And how long have you spent in the wild, watching animals in nature? If it's not much, then you can't truly say that they don't work miracles.

[G.A.]

I realized I made a mistake in my last post. I haven't personally seen the dead raised, but I have interviewed both the family members of the dead and those who have personally raised the dead. THe other things I have personally seen.

[Druidus]

heal the blind, deaf, parapelegic, AIDS,

Ok, but why is it not in the news? I've certainly never seen this. And how can we be sure that this is from "God" and not an innate power of humans? Do you have proof that you've seen this?

[G.A.]

Yes, I have truly seen healings, miracles, and deliverances from evil spirits. I have to confess that I don't live in the woods, but I still have never seen an animal perform a miracle. IT isn't on the news because most of the time the materialistic, rationalistic, secularistic viewpoint of the news media automatically discount such accounts as impossible. Regarding who was used to do such things, for the most part they were Christians from all walks of life on a team in Brazil or Mozambique or Ukraine or United States or England or China or Korea or Germany,et.al.

[G.A.]

I have medical records of a person who was dying of complications from AIDS with 14 days left to live who came from a hospice to receive prayer. Three days later he was totally healed. I have his medical records. I do not have other records but I have read others records who came to meetings with their doctors reports in hand proving the healing.

Regarding whether or not it was God or human inate ability I want to state that I believe any healing can have at least three sources. First, it can be from God, second, it can be from the power of the human spirit which isn't as powerful as the Holy Spirit of God, and third, it can be from a demonic spirit which is stronger than the human spirit, but can't begin to compare with the Holy Spirit's power.

[Feathers in Hair]

Originally Posted by Druidus

Really? Which? I don't want to sound crazy, but I have merged conciousness with a tree, and am trying to do the same with a bird (raven) using druidic meditation.

I fear you'd have to try a lot harder to sound crazy to me, at least! Several different trees, ferrets, dogs, cats, and a pelican. Merging conciousness/ sharing energy with a critter is much the same as with an tree, except the resonation back is quite a bit stronger. I find it much easier if the creature is a 'totem' animal, since some part of its spirit is yours already.

Be careful with Raven, though! They're tricky little so-and-so's!

Also, I do not doubt that the human spirit is more powerful than that of 'a demonic spirit.' If anything, the human and the animal/ plant/ crystal spirits, are the antithesis of evil, since (uncorrupted) they are closer in kin to Spirit than anything else.