Can 500+ Eyewitnesses Be Wrong? (Jesus, Earth, disciples, Corinthians)

[michel]

Originally Posted by Deut. 32.8

Your contempt for scholarship is far more diagnostic than surprising. Nevertheless, Kirby does no more than identify the type of consensus expressed here in the Introducton of the Catholic New American Bible ...

Nevertheless, acceptance of 2 Peter into the New Testament canon met with great resistance in the early church. The oldest certain reference to it comes from Origen in the early third century. While he himself accepted both Petrine letters as canonical, he testifies that others rejected 2 Peter. As late as the fifth century some local churches still excluded it from the canon, but eventually it was universally adopted. The principal reason for the long delay was the persistent doubt that the letter stemmed from the apostle Peter.


Among modern scholars there is wide agreement that 2 Peter is a pseudonymous work, i.e., one written by a later author who attributed it to Peter according to a literary convention popular at the time. It gives the impression of being more remote in time from the apostolic period than 1 Peter; indeed, many think it is the latest work in the New Testament and assign it to the first or even the second quarter of the second century.

That you applaud your own ignorance does little to redeem your argument.

First of all, Kirby is not the sum total of scholarship. Thus my 'contempt' for Kirby is not synonymous with 'contempt' for scholarship.

Second of all, acceptance of 2nd Peter into the New Testament canon meeting with great resistance in the early church is fine with me; as long as it wasn't met with great resistance in the early Church.

Third, where the Catholic New American Bible differs with the King James Bible, the Catholic New American Bible is wrong.

Fourth, where modern scholars differ with the King James Bible, modern scholars are wrong.

Fifth, Peter S. Ruckman calls Origen a 'walking, barefoot, ***tard' for reasons I don't want to get into.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Darkdale

That doesn't mean 500 eyewitnesses witnessed Jesus' resurrection. Why not just place your faith in your mythology and trust that your god will care for you? Why try to pretend like religion is objective or scientific?

What did they witness then, Expert?

And while you're not answering that, here's one you can't answer correctly:

How does 'my God' differ from mythology?

[michel]

Originally Posted by greatcalgarian

Did not know Paul wrote in English

Neither did I. Paul wrote in Koine Greek, and God eventually translated it into English.

[michel]

Originally Posted by greatcalgarian

Show and prove to us that it applied in the Greek version as well

Forget it. I don't know Greek, and even if I did, if you can't handle the English, you can't handle the Greek.

And, IMHO, it doesn't apply to the Greek version. They had their own literary idiosyncracies, I'm sure.

[Jayhawker Soule]

Originally Posted by AV1611

Fourth, where modern scholars differ with the King James Bible, modern scholars are wrong.

No, you believe them to be wrong, while openly making clear that it is a baseless and ossified belief.

[michel]

Originally Posted by drekmed

so, only moses actually "heard" god say anything, not that it is beyond god to choose who hears him. but exodus 20 says absolutely nothing about god writing anything, please read the passage before using it to try and discredit something i write.

drekmed, you're an excellent example of someone who doesn't know Scripture, but knows it "well enough" to know that those who do know it, don't know it.

You're right ... Exodus 20 says absolutely nothing about god writing anything ... I assumed you already knew that.

Exodus 31:18 = AND HE GAVE UNTO MOSES, WHEN HE HAD MADE AN END OF COMMUNING WITH HIM UPON MOUNT SINAI, TWO TABLES OF TESTIMONY, TABLES OF STONE, WRITTEN WITH THE FINGER OF GOD.

Deuteronomy 9:10 = AND THE LORD DELIVERED UNTO ME TWO TABLES OF STONE WRITTEN WITH THE FINGER OF GOD; ...

says nothing about the hand of god writing the words, although it could be assumed, but they were drunk and who knows what else, could have been hallucinating.

Daniel 5:23-24 = BUT HAST LIFTED UP THYSELF AGAINST THE LORD OF HEAVEN; ... THEN WAS PART OF THE HAND SENT FROM HIM.

this is "To the chief Musician upon Sheminith, A Psalm of David"

Believe me, drekmed, it's to you and me, too.

1 Corinthians 10:11 = NOW ALL THESE THINGS HAPPENED UNTO THEM FOR ENSAMPLES: AND THEY ARE WRITTEN FOR OUR ADMONITION, UPON WHOM THE ENDS OF THE WORLD ARE COME.

being in security, i question anything that appears to be falsified or out of the ordinary. if my boss tells me to do something and is standing in front of me, i'll dont need to question the authenticity, he told me himself. if someone i have never met comes up and says hey your boss says to do (insert command here) of course i'll question it and ask my boss, who would then be glad i was so vigilant in my duties.

Once again, since I didn't say anything about a false memo:

Try that at work when the boss sends a [legitimate] memo around and see how long you remain employed.

Let's can the foolishness, please, okay?

Luke 16 is believe to be a parable

So? I disagree, but still, didn't you get it's point? Or is it you can't see the forest for the trees?

nice try though. keep trying, maybe then you'll actually read the book like i have.

Um...

and just so you know, i did nothing more than read the chapters you gave with the verse, and came up with the answers for the bible parts.

That was obvious.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Deut. 32.8

No, you believe them to be wrong, while openly making clear that it is a baseless and ossified belief.

Don't forget 'vapid' and 'villified' too.

[JerryL]

No, your time-travel wasn't verified by God, Jerry. Where is it in Scripture?

Of course it was. My trip is attested to in Jerry 20:1, and the book of Jerry is attested to in Jerry 25:8 where God affirms it all God-breathed.

This time-travel story you're using is what God would call a 'false prophet'.

Where in scripture is the book of Jerry declared false?

Originally Posted by michel

Is there any way you can convince me of your time travel ?- I have been meaning to ask this for ages.

That depends entirely on your standard of proof.