trinity, godhead, or neither (Jesus Christ, translation, Holy Spirit, Holy Ghost, bible)

[michel]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

And I'm pretty sure that when Jesus was in Galilee, He wasn't simultaneously in Jerusalem.

I dont' think so either, His physical body would have prevented it.

[Aqualung]

Originally Posted by Maize

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: So it is but it isn't.


I think I'll go back to my unitarian corner and sit quietly.

Well, I guess it just depends who you are and what religion. I definitely don't think of a godhead and a trinity as being the same thing, those others might. It may be a hard concept (since I can't even explain it), but I don't think you should go back to a corner. Other view point are always nice, and they help me to see things in a different light.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Jensen

I"m not sure you understand what I mean. I believe that God is one. One, not a trinity, not a triune God, not three distint persons that are one God, but that God is one. And one only.

Do you see what I mean and believe?

Yes --- I do now --- thanks for clarifying.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Aqualung

Well, I guess it just depends who you are and what religion. I definitely don't think of a godhead and a trinity as being the same thing, those others might. It may be a hard concept (since I can't even explain it), but I don't think you should go back to a corner. Other view point are always nice, and they help me to see things in a different light.

Hi, Aqualung.

I can't explain the Godhead, either. It's just not something God choose to explain. Perhaps because it would just gender more questions. There are things we won't know until we get to Heaven, and unless someone finds how God did it embedded in the corpus of the Text somewhere, we'll just have to live with it undefined. It exists, but we just don't know the mechanics of it.

In some things in Scripture, like the fall of the city of Ai, God tells us what was done, how it was done, and who (or Who) did it.

But when it comes to miracles (a.k.a. singularities) and many divine aspects, God only tells us what was done, and Who did it.

[Tried-by-Fire]

What about when Jesus said this!
In this verse Jesus was talking and He told Nicodemus that the Son of man is (preasent tense) in heven.


John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

[michel]

Originally Posted by Tried-by-Fire

What about when Jesus said this!
In this verse Jesus was talking and He told Nicodemus that the Son of man is (preasent tense) in heven.


John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Good point. How could Jesus both be in Heaven and on the Earth at the same time, if God the Father isn't God the Son also?

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by AV1611

I dont' think so either, His physical body would have prevented it.

Okay, I have some questions for you then:

1. If He was unable to physically be in more than one place at once, does that mean He wasn't God after all?

2. Do you believe He ascended in bodily form into Heaven?

3. If the answer to question #2 is 'yes,' what do you think happened to his body once He arrived in heaven?

That's all for now. I'd like to see how you answer these three questions before I ask the next ones. I don't want to try to second-guess you with regards to what you believe.

[Jensen]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

I think that where I (and others) may be confused is that if you're a Christian, you've kind of ignored somebody -- be it God the Father, the Son Jesus Christ or the Holy Ghost. On the other hand, you may be saying that you believe that Jesus Christ was the Son of God, but not divine. I'm just trying to get a feel for what you believe, and I don't think I'm doing very well. Now if you're not a Christian in the first place, what you're saying makes perfect sense.

A Christian is anyone who believes in what the bible teaches (although we sometimes have some of it wrong in our understanding) and is a follower of Jesus the Son of God and his teachings given to him by God. I believe in God the Father, the Son of God..who is the Messiah and in the Holy Spirit. I also believe that there are angels. Deity is divine, but divine isn't always deity...in that I think that Jesus and the angels are divine, yet not God.

I don't see that a Christian's possible misunderstanding of the "composition" of God makes him any less a Christian.

Do you see what I'm saying?

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Tried-by-Fire

What about when Jesus said this!
In this verse Jesus was talking and He told Nicodemus that the Son of man is (preasent tense) in heven.


John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Good job! That's the first time I've ever seen anyone come up with that scripture to support the Trinity. I am honestly impressed.

However...

I don't believe that you have interpreted this verse correctly. Jesus is frequently described in the scriptures as "the Son of Man" and "the Son of God." He is God's Son; I think we can both agree on that. But what exactly does the phrase "the Son of Man" mean?

If the word "a" had been used instead of the word "the," we could interpret it as meaning "a descendent of Adam." For instance, in the Old Testament, Daniel is referred to as a "son of man." Obviously, Daniel and Jesus were two different individuals, and Daniel certainly wasn't God's only begotten Son. But "the Son of Man" is just another way of saying "the Son of God." Jesus is the Son of the archetypal Man, the perfect heavenly Man, the Eternal Father.

Going back to John 3:13, I believe that this scripture is saying the following (in modern English):

"No man has ascended to Heaven, except He who came down from Heaven, He who is the Son of God, who is in Heaven."

In other words, I believe that this verse is stating that God is in Heaven (present tense). Jesus Christ, at the time, was on earth. They were not both in the same place at once after all.