Jesus is God? (Messiah, HaShem, crucifixion, Kingdom, Jehovah) - Page 34

Poisonshady313 · #**331** 06-10-2008, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

I
The Masoretic text (original Hebrew) in English translation reaeds:
"14. Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel."

Is with child.

When this prophecy was spoken, the woman was already pregnant. This prophecy was fulfilled 700 years before Jesus was even a twinkle in Mary's eye.

emiliano · #**332** 06-10-2008, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crystalonyx

There are many, many equivalent tales of virgin births in other religions, do you believe all of them?

Yes there are, but how many of them are still around? How many billion of people do believe in them? Every thing that exist has a reason, what do you think the reason for Christianity existence is? How it has expanded to cover the whole world as it was prophesied? There must be a reason, don’t you think?

Jeremy Mason · #**333** 06-10-2008, 06:16 PM

[

Quote:

quote=Dirty Penguin;1180557]Well, you did right by staying away from the quotes in Revelation seeing as though they show God on the throne to be separate from the lamb (Yeshua the Messiah) whom God hands the scroll to, to be open.......

As far as the Holy Spirit......All you have shown here it that God caused Mary to be pregnant without male intervention. We know, by observing the scriptures, that Yeshua existed in heaven with his god before his god "sent" him to earth. It would appear the method inwhich he was sent was by the will, as Yeshua says, and by the power (holy spirit) of God.

We know that no physical act occured between her and her god so God is not a biological father in the sense that we understand it but we know that God is the reason for Adams beginning as well and he is referred to as the son of God. In fact the bible states that God has plenty of sons.

The holy spirit, which you call God, is present within people throughout the bible. Zachariah and Elizabeth were filled with the holy spirit. Are they to be considred "God in the flesh"......?........If Yeshua is God and the holy spirit is God then why did the holy spirit decend upon himself?

As far as the reference to (Immanuel/Emmanuel)....No where in the four gospels was Yeshua referred to by that descrption. This was purely the writers intepretation regarding an OT prophecy. Mary was instruscted to call her son "Yeshua" and that's what she did....son of God has never been synonymous with (God)
I stand by my previous post. If you like you can continue to assert Yeshua to be God but you'd be hard pressed to explain why the acended Yeshua, who is supposed to be God, would tell John he has a god (not 1 but 4 times in "one" verse). You'd also be hard pressed to explain why, if Yeshua is God, does the "Lamb" in heaven, who is supposed to be Yeshua the Messiah, steps forward to take the scroll from God because he is the only one deemed worth to open the seals. Remember...God had the scroll in his possesion...his creation asks.."Who's worthy of opening the seals"....NONE of Gods' creation would dare ask if God was worthy. They knew it was to be opened by some one other than their god.....

I'll stick with my posts as well. They adequately proof the deity of Christ.

emiliano · #**334** 06-11-2008, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poisonshady313

Is with child.

When this prophecy was spoken, the woman was already pregnant. This prophecy was fulfilled 700 years before Jesus was even a twinkle in Mary's eye.

OK so there was a child 700 years before the birth of Jesus, what became of him? I thought that this was Isaiah Prophecy
Isa 9:6 For to us a Child is born, to us a Son is given; and the government shall be on His shoulder; and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
a prophecy of restoration of the chosen people to a better priesthood. the destruction of idolatrous sinners, and the rejection of their sacrifices. The prophet’s harsh prophecy with charges of great sinfulness also contain the promise of great King after the discipline.

Popeyesays · #**335** 06-11-2008, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emiliano

OK so there was a child 700 years before the birth of Jesus, what became of him? I thought that this was Isaiah Prophecy
Isa 9:6 For to us a Child is born, to us a Son is given; and the government shall be on His shoulder; and His name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.
a prophecy of restoration of the chosen people to a better priesthood. the destruction of idolatrous sinners, and the rejection of their sacrifices. The prophet’s harsh prophecy with charges of great sinfulness also contain the promise of great King after the discipline.

And to give further spin to the coin here, Baha`i's believe the everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace is a reference to Baha`u'llah since Jesus never did any of those things.

Neither of course, did the son of Ahaz do any of those things.

Which goes to show that prophecy must be understood on several levels at the same time.

Regards,
Scott

Scott1 · #**336** 06-11-2008, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khale

Jesus is God(YHWH). It seems to me that we are worshipping the same deity. Am I correct? Why or why not?

Yep.

Poisonshady313 · #**337** 06-11-2008, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

And to give further spin to the coin here, Baha`i's believe the everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace is a reference to Baha`u'llah since Jesus never did any of those things.

Neither of course, did the son of Ahaz do any of those things.

Which goes to show that prophecy must be understood on several levels at the same time.

Regards,
Scott

Judaism maintains that Hezekiah is the prince of peace.

emiliano · #**338** 06-11-2008, 05:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poisonshady313

Judaism maintains that Hezekiah is the prince of peace.

What of the rest, The mighty God, The everlasting Father?

UnityNow101 · #**339** 06-11-2008, 06:06 AM

Nobody seems to look at this issue from the very foundation. Does it matter whether Jesus was God or not? If he was, than he disappeared and it was as if he never was to begin with. If he was not, than nothing else changes either. Even with the book, there is not a clear answer. So we are just going by what we think that the book seems to tell us. Can any of it be known without the book? Absolutely NOT! I have been in the position of searching endlessly for "truth" in different books and teachers and have begun to understand that they are all giving us the run-around. If it cannot be known even using the book, than should it matter to us? We cannot go back and find out for ourselves. So we must drop the gimmickry and look for what is truth. And if it has to be searched out in a book, than it is likely to not be the truth at all.