crucifiction (Jesus, rituals, reject, Earth, Messiah)

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by yirme

i knew a guy that drank a little each morning and he said it completely removed his arthritis.

I knew a professor who believed a glass of water mixed with blackstrap mollasses and vinegar was healthy.

I was glad he found it palatable for that reason, but it's truly disgusting.

Regards,
Scott

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by yirme

so you believe that the sponge that was held up to jesus contained enough vinegar to preserve him?

As I said no way.....does anyone realize the amount of embalming fluid it takes to preserve a human being? Far beyond the small quanity that Jesus would have gotten out of that sponge. The Romans at the time were fully capable of utilizing their techniques to mummify Jesus had they been so inclined to do so...The Romans and Greeks were practicing mummification long before the Ancient Egyptians. It was the Ancient Egyptians who took the process to a higher level of technique. Brain death occurs 4 to 6 minutes after death had Jesus came to life after being dead for 3 days with out divine intervention he would have been a complete vegetable. Bodily functions in some organs will continue after death hearing is one. But after 3 days total organ shutdown would have occured.

[Heneni]

I dont know how much of it he drank. I always thought it was a bit cruel to give him vinegar when he said he was thirsty.

There must have been some way for Jesus's body to not undergo decay for three days. And I think the vinegar might have had something to do with preserving the internal organs in some way.

As far as the people who did not have faith that he would be ressurrected. The people that did touch and handle his body after his death, must have believed what Jesus said. Or atleast they were going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Also, Lazarus, was quite a nasty sight I think after three days, and he came out of the tomb not looking like a zombie im sure. And if he did Jesus would have done him a great injustice.

But if whatever they did to bodies those days, were good enough to preserve a body for at least three days, then I guess whatever was done to Jesus's body must have been good enough too.

As the writer of the original post states, it seems like the customs were changed a bit when it came to the balming of the body. Of course I am taking his word for it, but I have no such evidence myself.

love
heneni

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Heneni

Also does vinegar not change into alchohol when digested by the stomach? Alchohol is also a preservative.

People with lots of alcohol in their system take longer to decay than other too.

Natural fermented substances turn to vinegar over time when the presence of the alcohol finally kills off the yeast.

I don't know that it transforms to alcohol in the stomach, at least long enough to be absorbed into the blood stream.

I heard of a Japanese gentleman who could nto eat wheat because his body created fermentable compounds and he could literally become drunk from eating soda crackers.

That may, of course, be urban legend.

Regards,
Scott

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Heneni

I dont know how much of it he drank. I always thought it was a bit cruel to give him vinegar when he said he was thirsty.

There must have been some way for Jesus's body to not undergo decay for three days. And I think the vinegar might have had something to do with preserving the internal organs in some way.

As far as the people who did not have faith that he would be ressurrected. The people that did touch and handle his body after his death, must have believed what Jesus said. Or atleast they were going to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Also, Lazarus, was quite a nasty sight I think after three days, and he came out of the tomb not looking like a zombie im sure. And if he did Jesus would have done him a great injustice.

But if whatever they did to bodies those days, were good enough to preserve a body for at least three days, then I guess whatever was done to Jesus's body must have been good enough too.

As the writer of the original post states, it seems like the customs were changed a bit when it came to the balming of the body. Of course I am taking his word for it, but I have no such evidence myself.

love
heneni

The purpose of preparing a body in Judaica is the same as in the Baha`i burial preparation.

The body is washed, anointed with oils. It is wrapped in the shroud, occasionally sprinkled with rosewater and the wrapped body is placed in the casket. There is no embalming involved. In fact embalming is distasteful in Jewish burials.

Regards,
Scott

[Yoda]

They never expounded on what was done to the body other than wrapping it in cloth....the spear in Jesus side would have no doubt caused massive internal injuries that would have been hard for even a normal human being to live through.....I can only imagine how painful it was....I read an article a while back on this I wish I had bookmarked it....

[Yoda]

Originally Posted by Popeyesays

The purpose of preparing a body in Judaica is the same as in the Baha`i burial preparation.

The body is washed, anointed with oils. It is wrapped in the shroud, occasionally sprinkled with rosewater and the wrapped body is placed in the casket. There is no embalming involved. In fact embalming is distasteful in Jewish burials.

Regards,
Scott

Exactly Scott. Islam is the same way. They did not embalm Pope John Paul....traditons change granted.....Embalming did not arrive in the US until the 1850s...sorry to the OP I did not mean to go OT.......

[Heneni]

Hello scott.

Rosewater? Do you know what the purpose of the rosewater was?

[Heneni]

Just checked on the net. Rosewater is used as a toner for the skin especially for dry skin.
Skin dries out when you die. So then why would they want to hinder the skin becoming dry?

Rosewater must have been used to help preserve the skin and the vinegar could have been a way to preserve the internal organs.

Oh I just used the word embalming as a general term for what people do to dead bodies.

But in hindsight they also did some things to preserve the body. NO?

[Popeyesays]

Originally Posted by Heneni

Just checked on the net. Rosewater is used as a toner for the skin especially for dry skin.
Skin dries out when you die. So then why would they want to hinder the skin becoming dry?

Rosewater must have been used to help preserve the skin and the vinegar could have been a way to preserve the internal organs.

Oh I just used the word embalming as a general term for what people do to dead bodies.

But in hindsight they also did some things to preserve the body. NO?

In a word, no.

Preserving the bodey is exaqctly what they do not wishe to do. They want it to go ahead and corrupt. The flesh is dust.

Baha`i's use rosewater because it smells nice. We often use rosewater to commemorate Holy Days because the frragrance is nice. It is also used in cooking in Persia and the Middle East.

From the Jewish Burial Soci9ety website:
"
We explained earlier that the earth is compared to the womb of a mother preparing a person for life. Similarly, wheat and other plants only start growing after the seeds rot completely into the earth. The earth contains the four basic forces of all life: fire, water, air and earth. From these basic forces emanate the powers of energy, heat, electricity, hydrogen, nitrogen, etc. Rot means separating the parts and particles of an object and bringing it back to its source in order to renew its growth. Burning results in destroying and demolishing the parts. Burning the seeds of a plant makes any further growth and reproduction impossible. Fertilizer which comes completely from rot gives a plant the power of growth. However, fertilizer that comes solely from ashes has had all the energy burned out of it. It cannot provide plants with nourishment for growth unless it is mixed with a rot-based fertilizer the essence of which remains intact. So it is with the burial of a persons body in the earth which is necessary preparation for the growth of new life which we will experience at the time of the Revival of the Dead."

Please, do not look for me to provide you with straws to grasp. I find your argument sillly.
Jews at the time of Jesus were njot buried in the earth at all. They were laid to rest with no embalming so the body could go ahead and decompose as expeditiously as possible. When the flesh was truly gone, the bones would be laid away in an ossuary and placed in a mausoleum. In today's world the coffin is supposed to be pierced so that decomposition can be hastened, there is no embalming and the coffin is not air or water tight to hasten decomnposition. In some localities this is not legal and Jewish burial follows the law of the land if it must--with the exception of cremation.

Regards,
Scott